Ep. 17: Doing The Mahi with Troy Hammond

 

Unedited Transcript with Troy Hammond

00:00.47
katrinamcollier
Troy Hammond, welcome to Beyond the Damage of Words podcast. I am absolutely thrilled to be talking to you because we’ve just realized it’s been like 6 years or 7 years since we’ve seen each other, which is mad. Um I was open straight off with the question of what led you into healing what happened how did you get there.

00:17.82
Troy Hammond
Yeah, well, I think as we were just talking about before the podcast, I, um, I found myself in a position where I was like mid-30 s carrying a lot of like childhood trauma. Um.

00:19.49
katrinamcollier
That’s simple, really.

00:34.60
Troy Hammond
And it was like it was a real fork in my road where I realized that as a father, I could either be a great role model and heal myself and really do the work on myself to be someone that I wanted my kids to be proud of or I could take the easier path.

00:34.62
katrinamcollier
Um.

00:37.58
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

00:46.33
katrinamcollier
And.

00:52.40
Troy Hammond
Which was while I went South Pity not hear myself just keep masking things and and doing things which is a lot easier you know and and a lot of people take that path. Um, but I decided that yeah I wanted to be.

00:58.10
katrinamcollier
Oh yeah, and I think so society makes you want to mask doesn’t it. There’s almost this desire for perfection all the time that it’s it becomes very easy to do that. But it’s not sustainable as you discovered.

01:11.81
Troy Hammond
Yeah, especially in this society I wear everything’s on social media and everything’s a veneer of what your life is you know and you’re trying to show the best parts of your life. It’s so much easier just to put a mask on and pretend. Everything’s okay and you know not feel the judgment of you know a million people on social media or the.

01:21.64
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

01:30.67
Troy Hammond
But lack of likes which is probably even more important these days on social media right.

01:33.43
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, so anyway I I totally interrupted your train of thought so you were deciding in that fork which way you were going to go so.

01:41.86
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah, it was a pretty heavy time for me in my life like I went through pretty um, like divorce young kids had a business you know that I’d set up only a couple of years prior so it was a pretty heavy time in my life and. Just remember looking down at my kids and thinking I don’t want to do what my parents did and that sort of you know that child trauma that I carried forced me to well not force me but allowed me to be a ah version of myself that I didn’t like to you know to.

01:58.45
katrinamcollier
Um.

02:16.33
katrinamcollier
Um.

02:16.55
Troy Hammond
Cover up what was going on in my life and it wasn’t until that day that I decided to go to psychology you know and I was like hey I really need to talk to someone about this that I was able to understand Well I was able to forgive myself as a young child and it’s funny right? You hear this term all the time in Psychology Forgive yourself you know, forgive that version of yourself.

02:21.56
katrinamcollier
And.

02:30.13
katrinamcollier
Um.

02:35.16
Troy Hammond
But when you go through the process. It’s so true like I’ll give you some baxter um on my life. Um, yeah, so my I grew up with my mom was a full-blown alcoholic. Um, she um.

02:37.22
katrinamcollier
Yeah, and so.

02:51.90
Troy Hammond
Was pretty manipulative and horrible to us because of you know, like Narcissist behavior where because she knew how horrible she was as a person she would be super super lovely or horrible and cold and when she was horrible and cold. You know she would try and make up for it. Two weeks later with you know, acts of kindness and um.

03:08.86
katrinamcollier
So.

03:10.92
Troy Hammond
But within those two weeks she was like drunk most of the time or she’d have guys around and likes and so yeah and so my parents separated when I was 10 I think I was um and then I um I remember the first time I went to my dad ended up. Um.

03:17.80
katrinamcollier
Yes, yeah.

03:28.49
Troy Hammond
Meeting someone that we knew like a family friend and because my mom was having an affair and that’s why he left but because he went off to meet he went with someone that we knew as a family friend at just sent my mom over the cliff and she would go around my dad’s house and throw rocks through the windows and.

03:36.54
katrinamcollier
Um.

03:45.87
Troy Hammond
Like it was that would be constantly fighting all the time and and there wasn’t the blame put on us as kids you know? And so yeah, so I developed this? ah.

03:51.89
katrinamcollier
Yeah, because it wasn’t her fault it. It wasn’t her fault. It was obviously your fault and your dad’s fault and your stepmom’s fault. It was everyone else’s fault. Yeah I have one for a mother I know how this works I Oh yeah, tough really tough.

04:01.28
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah, we yeah narcissists are pretty easy to understand when you when you read up about it and you know like it’s um, yeah, that indeed yeah in slow.

04:13.00
katrinamcollier
And when you’re out of the web when you’ve got free. Ah.

04:19.26
Troy Hammond
Yeah, so I had to so I had to pretend a lot as a ten year old like I had to like because my dad was really worried about what was happening at my mom’s house. Um and he would say is everything okay and I’d just pretend put a mask and and say everything’s fine. Yeah, even though he had no idea that I was like my mom wasn’t home for weeks on end I was.

04:21.54
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

04:33.98
katrinamcollier
So ah.

04:37.80
Troy Hammond
11 years old making dinners and breakfast and lunches for my brother and having to steal food you know for just you know to feed him and then I’d go to my dad’s house and it would be great. You know like we’d have a functioning family with like my brother and my 2 step brothers and and then my mom my step mom and my dad.

04:48.39
katrinamcollier
I take it. You did you feel like you couldn’t tell your dad the truth because it would create these explosions and all of this drama.

05:01.59
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah, well I can yeah so my dad would rush around to my um, no, it’s it’s horrible right? and and then that you’d feel that blame right as a kid that’s that’s why you got to feel sorry for yourself because you feel that blame like I felt like I was the one that made this happen because my dad would come around that have a huge fight. It’d be.

05:04.47
katrinamcollier
That’s a lot for a ten or eleven year old

05:14.62
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

05:19.29
Troy Hammond
You know, like police were involved. They’d be screaming at each other and I felt the blame of that was my fault I shouldn’t have said anything and so you learn pretty quickly as a kid just to keep your mouth shut or or you put this maskscot and pretend. Everything’s okay and so I’d say to my dad. Yeah, everything’s great now. Mom’s home a lot. She’s not drinking.

05:20.60
katrinamcollier
1

05:27.47
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

05:35.58
Troy Hammond
And then when I get back from my dad’s my momm would say oh you know who was all your dad’s and I’d go. Oh yeah, it was pretty crap. Actually you know didn’t have fun at all the Mu you’re good. You know like he’s not a great guy and then not a great family and so I realized well I didn’t realize but I as a child What what happened for me is I.

05:42.46
katrinamcollier
No so.

05:54.29
Troy Hammond
I was trying to seek love from other people to fill my own cup. You know, just by putting these masks on when I told people what they wanted to hear I became better about myself. What I didn’t actually become better but I didn’t become worse and so that was the trait that I learned yeah and so that.

05:59.28
katrinamcollier
Ah, yeah, exactly.

06:09.49
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, and it’s that um, that almost that’s how the people pleasing and perfectionism and things like that start is is when you’re always putting someone else’s needs ahead of your own to feel safe.

06:12.32
Troy Hammond
That happened for you.

06:18.22
Troy Hammond
Yeah, indeed. Yeah yeah, yeah of course right? of course and so and then I did the worst thing that you can do when someone’s in that situation left school at 14 and got a job in sales stupid idea.

06:25.67
katrinamcollier
You actually probably did that to feel safe. Yeah.

06:37.43
Troy Hammond
Because then I’m just going out and using using that skillset that I’d home to um, please people. Um for a craft and obviously you know if someone um, had your mind I was very good. Yeah I was.

06:43.66
katrinamcollier
Yeah I bet you were very good at that.

06:52.96
Troy Hammond
Was very good understanding of people’s empathetic needs were very quickly in a situation and then telling them exactly what they wanted to hear and so so then I started making a lot of money from from using this craft that I developed and so that probably just empowered me as a you know 16 year old to then to.

06:55.88
katrinamcollier
Ah, yeah god.

07:07.93
katrinamcollier
Um.

07:12.71
Troy Hammond
Think well this is this is who I am now and so then it became my mantra that I’m going to I’m going to woo myself out of the situation by becoming rich and successful and I don’t ever want to have to feel that pain that I went through you know, starving and stealing food and doing all these things again. So.

07:14.70
katrinamcollier
I.

07:25.35
katrinamcollier
5

07:31.42
Troy Hammond
My mantra was you know I can do whatever I want you know I can grow myself out of this and so and then I said that’s what I did.

07:36.00
katrinamcollier
Yeah, is such a shame that comes with the the stealing for food I um was I’ve written about like doing a lot of work on money and the energy around money and.

07:42.60
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah.

07:49.87
katrinamcollier
Some of my earliest memories are stealing. My father’s small change so I could get food on the way home from school and just that just so many emotions around that like kind of anger that he didn’t give me the money in the first place and then shame that I stole and all this kind of stuff and we weren’t we weren’t as destitute a situation as you’re talking about either.

07:53.66
Troy Hammond
Yeah, were yeah.

08:06.43
Troy Hammond
And and and it’s still surprised me now like I’ve better I’ve got to um I shouldn’t say this on a podcast but I’ve got a draw with some cash in it that I always keep there just if overate some cash and my daughter last night goes oh dad can I go and shop and get them.

08:08.44
katrinamcollier
So I can only imagine what you were feeling just crazy.

08:20.25
katrinamcollier
Um, that’s okay, we know you live in Auckland but.

08:25.44
Troy Hammond
Yeah, welcome. Yeah um, and so yeah, but my daughter said they can now have some cash to go down and the dairy and get something dairy is a corner store for you or a milk bar for Australia um, and us. yeah yeah I was like hey go down and yeah, go and grab some cash ah and then.

08:32.76
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, yeah milk bar for a strain. Yep.

08:43.78
Troy Hammond
Found myself like walking in the check how not she’d fat taken. But for her she has no concept of like worrying about taking this money or thinking that there’s a lot of money there and you know she’s just like took $20 she came back and gave him the change or if that was me kid I would have been like oh my god I’m going to feed myself here for three months you know I’m going to steal as much as I can to you know to do things and so.

08:44.67
katrinamcollier
Ah.

08:53.27
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

08:59.87
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

09:03.12
Troy Hammond
It’s yeah so lovely to know that that money isn’t her motivator you know, but it was my motivator and so sadly it it carried me through a lot of my life. You know like I I let the the aspiration of being rich and successful. Um.

09:06.40
katrinamcollier
But haven’t done that. Um.

09:22.75
Troy Hammond
Carrying me through a lot of grind so it took me out of a shitty situation in my family because I moved at home when I was 16 no fourteen sorry I at that home when I was fourteen and a half soon as I could leave school I was like see later I’m out and went into um I did a shitty job first painting apprenticeship. Don’t recommend that unless you’re an alcoholic or a drunk or yeah.

09:26.13
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

09:33.40
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

09:40.29
katrinamcollier
Um, of course. Yeah, yeah.

09:42.62
Troy Hammond
And then found sales and then that that led me out of that. Um, but and and to be honest, ah it brings you money brings you short term happiness. You know like it. It took me away from the pain that I was feeling it. It makes you feel like.

09:56.42
katrinamcollier
Ah, so true. So you you mentioned? Yeah so I’m thinking of your journey So from there and obviously I know you you’ve got married and then have since it’s you’ve got divorced.

10:00.51
Troy Hammond
You can do anything.

10:10.45
katrinamcollier
But you mentioned psychology. So what was the step that led you to that point So you’ve you’ve obviously realized you’re building and building and building in a direction that actually wasn’t healthy for you.

10:13.79
Troy Hammond
Well, it was because yeah yeah, so I got I that led me to creating a company like it led me from site but to sales lots of money and then let me create ah to creating a company and then that company was very successful.

10:26.69
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah. And.

10:33.66
Troy Hammond
And so my murders Operaatus as a father and as a husband was to put food on the table and to have a beautiful house and a successful life and take my family on holidays and so that’s the way I thought that I had to give you know and so my love language is gift giving or you know showering people with with things.

10:36.62
katrinamcollier
And. Yeah, yeah, yeah, um, yeah.

10:52.56
Troy Hammond
And so it turns out that wasn’t my ex-wife’s love language you know I was working away a lot. You know I was grinding I was always out entertaining clients and doing things and hers was quality time I Probably guess you know and so that led yeah that led us to um.

10:59.65
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

11:05.93
katrinamcollier
Ah, okay, either way this is the 5 love languages if people if anyone listening hasn’t heard of the five love languages I actually think it’s one of the easiest tools to have in the toolbox. There’s just once you know what? somebody’s love language is or their main one is is super.

11:16.11
Troy Hammond
Yeah. Yeah, well through psychology now and through in the in the yeah and so.

11:23.14
katrinamcollier
Super easy. Having been hugged by me quite several times you can guess mine’s touch right? Ah literally. Ah, but God I can’t talk to someone incoming for a hug. Oh sorry yours as gifts is it too bad. Yeah, so obviously so you now realize that.

11:38.35
Troy Hammond
Yeah.

11:43.40
katrinamcollier
You weren’t you know you weren’t giving her what she needed. Um.

11:46.34
Troy Hammond
Yeah I wasn’t giving her what she needed we. We got divorced her choice. She found someone else. Um, and then that fucked with me, you know it really messed with my head because I was like this successful guy and I was a good father you know like ah good father I wasn’t a great father I was a good father I wasn’t there for my kids a lot and so I was I found myself looking in the mirror like about a week after getting divorced or separating and looking back at a guy that was.

12:02.18
katrinamcollier
Um, ah.

12:14.60
katrinamcollier
The.

12:18.80
Troy Hammond
Ah, hundred and thirty five Kilos at the time um a normallyly. So I’m currentlying her in a hundred I think I am and so like very overweight um, successful with I had money? yeah twelve six or 3 you know, big and um.

12:21.66
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, you’re tall aren’t you. But yeah, just thinking you got to put that in perspective of those Kilos to that you are tall I remember hugging up. Ah.

12:34.70
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah, but if you look actually yeah if I look back the last time you and I are you and I would have caught up like I would have been a different guy like I’m much good guy and so yeah I look back at the mirror and I thought to myself The fuck is this guy you know like who is this person and.

12:38.78
katrinamcollier
Which I don’t do with that many people at five nine yeah yeah, yeah, and

12:54.54
Troy Hammond
It was um, it was the but the hardest time like the hardest reflection I’ve ever seen of myself because I started seeing myself through the masks that I’ve been creating and I hadn’t done anything about this until then and so that morning I decided.

13:02.68
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

13:13.13
Troy Hammond
<unk>d signed up to a half marathon. Um months ago like new trim terrific Troy Hammond HammondHammondwas the you know the thing at the time I never did anything about it didn’t run. Um and I’d been up all night because I was so heartbroken.

13:20.56
katrinamcollier
Yeah, what is it with men when they they just go I’m just going to go and run and you kind of watch them running fast. You’re like oh no heart attack wave you happen Stop stop? Yeah, there’s a few round here. It’s bit scary like oh my God Maybes Try walking first. Yeah.

13:32.30
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but those first runs are hard. Those first runs are hard but definitely worth and so yeah I got up that morning after like 1 hour sleep and then just decided I’m going to do this half marathon and so I quickly put my stuff on and.

13:40.20
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

13:46.73
katrinamcollier
Oh.

13:50.83
Troy Hammond
And I realized I looked at the clock and I realized I didn’t I didn’t have time to walk there so I had to run to them heart Marathon swat and then ran ran to the finish. The the start line just as they hit go and then I had to run and it was It was like yeah you talk about heart attack people I thought I was going to have a heart attack at two Ks in and so.

13:57.46
katrinamcollier
Ah.

14:01.96
katrinamcollier
Oh my goodness.

14:09.90
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

14:10.39
Troy Hammond
Ah, Two K in I stopped and I turned around and I was like well I’m going to walk back to the start line because it’s easier to get the start than to go all the way to the end and I saw this little little old lady that just she went you know as if to say all the poor guy. Um, and I don’t know what it was about that but I was like stuff this so I turned around and I just ran.

14:16.70
katrinamcollier
And yeah.

14:25.82
katrinamcollier
Oh plusful. That’s amazing Crazy Absolutely crazy, but amazing that you did it? yeah.

14:30.90
Troy Hammond
And and it was liberating right to achieve something it was. It was so amazing. Yeah yeah, and so then I decided that that day I was like all right I’m going to go and see a psychologist and I’m going to fix myself and I’m I’m going to do the mahi or the work.

14:45.88
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

14:49.47
Troy Hammond
Um, myself and and as ah, um, yeah Mahi is a multi word for um, for the work for strong strong work and so yeah, do the mahi. Um, and so then yeah, it’s so one sort of psychologist and.

14:50.44
katrinamcollier
Is that a memory word I noticed that in your post.

14:59.15
katrinamcollier
I Love it I.

15:07.95
Troy Hammond
Someone that has spent for anyone that’s listening that’s had childhood trauma you know you get to ah about 32 35 where you we carry that where you have to do something about it. Um, and I remember the first 3 or 4 sessions of my psychologist.

15:14.24
katrinamcollier
And then the.

15:23.30
Troy Hammond
You know him gonna this Troy Hammond HammondHammondguy is a nice guy and yeah I’m I’m thinking he must think I’m a nice guy and you know this there’s not that much wrong with him. He seems to have it together and that’s just because I was lying. You know I was I wasn’t letting him in I wasn’t telling the truth. Um and it wasn’t until um.

15:38.84
katrinamcollier
You’d started putting those barriers up as a kid you weren’t about to let anybody in quickly. But it was I got to earn and their right to get through those barriers.

15:41.74
Troy Hammond
Man I was living in tell I was going to ah up up. Yeah I was probably trying to make him feel better. My psychologist you know, like at the end of the the end of the different I would have been like he must feel better now. Oh he’s going to have a great day me terrible day. But yeah.

15:54.38
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah, is that people plasing isn’t it. That’s that yeah make everyone happy and that’s peaceful.

15:59.27
Troy Hammond
And it wasn’t until I um, yeah, yeah, I wasn’t until he said something to me and I can’t remember exactly what it was but he said and what I want you to do this to at time Troy Hammond HammondHammondis be honest and I said well and he goes well you know you’ve spent your first 3 sessions. Telling me your version of your life. How about we here about your life now and I was like oh shit you know and there was something about that that went. Okay well I’m just going to be honest now and and then at the end of that session I’d felt better. You know and it was the first time that I’d felt better in a long time and.

16:36.52
katrinamcollier
You were sane where you you were saying baby Troy Hammond HammondHammondwas saying like that’s amazing. Yeah.

16:38.30
Troy Hammond
So then? yeah yeah’ exactly and so yeah, so I decided from from then on you know like I was I was going to try and heal myself and as you’ll know right? It’s ah it’s a marathon It’s not a half marathon or a sprint you know it’s a. It’s a full on marathon to hear we though.

16:57.66
katrinamcollier
It’s layers. Yeah I mean it’s just it’s getting through those layers and layers and layers and it’s complex as well and particularly when you’ve had um the narcissism so you’ve had the ghosting So you’re thinking. There’s always that.

17:05.77
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah.

17:14.18
katrinamcollier
What was the truth. What was the reality that bloody gaslighting. Yeah so that’s amazing. So obviously oh sorry.

17:17.16
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah, what that yeah say the hardest thing for me was that I still carried pretty bad anxiety because of that like even as I was sort of healing myself and then that manifested into like for years before I was divorced and kind of couple the years after as I was trying to fix myself.

17:28.45
katrinamcollier
Um.

17:32.82
katrinamcollier
And.

17:36.26
Troy Hammond
Like fall on panic attacks trying to and like and and I wasn’t sure I wasn’t ever sure of why I was getting anxiety or panic attacks because as I was healing myself I felt like I was a lot better and I didn’t feel like I was carrying stressed but and so I wasn’t I wasn’t sure so I read it? yeah.

17:39.93
katrinamcollier
Ah.

17:42.90
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, yeah, feel lighter don’t you as it’s going. It’s like you just keep start getting lighter and lighter here but yet panic attacks.

17:55.10
Troy Hammond
Yeah, and but and but then occasionally I’d be at work and I would just feel like I was dying. You know I couldn’t catch my breath and then I’d have to go and sit in a boardroom and take my shoes and socks off for some reason that that was what I did and feel the carpet on my feet and try and feel you know in touch with the world and.

18:07.71
katrinamcollier
2 Yeah.

18:12.77
Troy Hammond
And then that would calm me down or I would call someone I used to be able to call my ex-wife you can. It’s not so great to call your ex-wife when she’s your ex-wife and so you know then I realized I had to figure out. Otherwise yeah.

18:15.93
katrinamcollier
Just.

18:22.58
katrinamcollier
I know I call my ex-husband all the time. So I think it’s lovely that you’ve kept your friendship like it is good that you can’t actually call her. Yeah yeah, but at that point it’s interesting. You say about taking your shoes off on a spiritual you were grounding.

18:31.88
Troy Hammond
Oh just that’s great now. That’s great now. Um, but I.

18:39.68
Troy Hammond
Yeah.

18:41.26
katrinamcollier
Like you were bringing yourself down into the earth. That’s what you were doing by taking your shoes off which I love like we don’t touch the earth enough.

18:45.13
Troy Hammond
Um, yeah, well and people don’t see people that don’t get anxiety or panic attacks can’t understand what it is and I would say like the way I describe it to people is. It’s like imagine fight or flight.

18:52.54
katrinamcollier
Do my.

18:58.30
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

18:59.12
Troy Hammond
And you imagine time that like that fear of someone’s chasing me or someone’s doing it times that by a thousand and your heart’s racing. You’re sweating you can’t control your thoughts you feel like you’re spinning in a room.

19:05.85
katrinamcollier
Ah.

19:11.94
katrinamcollier
And.

19:13.32
Troy Hammond
Um, yeah I mine my manifest into breathing so I can’t catch my foot my breath and then I become short at breath and then I feel like I’m I’m dying and so yeah I I was getting this a lot and so I started reading about this and as I you know was.

19:17.63
katrinamcollier
Wow.

19:24.82
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

19:29.93
Troy Hammond
Healing myself and and every way I wanted to fix this. This was the last thing that I wanted to fix and so I watched like every Youtube video I caught on anxiety I read every book I listened to every podcast. Um, and then I I read about um psychedelic treatment for um, for depression and and anxiety and I watched her.

19:30.24
katrinamcollier
And.

19:41.48
katrinamcollier
Ah.

19:44.46
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, and.

19:49.69
Troy Hammond
And documentary I read a book and then I thought well I’m going to try this and so I um went and I don’t recommend it I’m not doctor and so don’t don’t don’t do as I say do research but I did a really high um dose Lsd experience to learn about my.

20:00.47
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, so.

20:09.20
Troy Hammond
Um, anxiety and yeah it it was. It was a bad trip for what it’s worth it was ah um, a pretty horrible existence I took I did it on my own in in my house by myself. Don’t yeah yeah.

20:09.91
katrinamcollier
But yeah, so you did that on your own. Not yeah, that’s definitely not recommended. There are places that you can definitely go and have it safely administered.

20:27.83
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah I recommend Well, there’s there’s so many? yeah, there’s so many who between roles now that are um, you know not stupid guy on his own. But um, what happened to me as I.

20:29.87
katrinamcollier
As well like microdosing is now a thing as well like it’s psychedelics are growing but safely there are yeah, don’t do Troy Hammond.

20:42.33
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

20:46.76
Troy Hammond
Went to a pretty dark place where I thought that I thought that I was actually trapped inside my body I thought I had locked in so I knew in syndrome and I had that for about 5 hours and then towards the end of that 5 hours I started thinking to myself.

20:54.33
katrinamcollier
Yeah, oh my word.

21:04.46
Troy Hammond
What am I actually worried about even if I am locked in for the rest of my life like what am I worried about and I thought my kids are going to be okay because I’ve been a great dad. You know my ex has been a great mom. We’ve given them a fantastic life. They’ve got the right values. No matter if I die or if I’m locked in or whatever it is.

21:11.80
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

21:21.59
Troy Hammond
I’m going to be Okay, they’re going to be okay and because of that I’m going to be okay and it was like a light just went off in that moment where I just thought I don’t need to worry about that anymore and then um I came out of the um experience. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

21:22.95
katrinamcollier
And.

21:32.88
katrinamcollier
Um, do can you see the symbolism of what why you were trapped now though like you were sort of like trapped with all your masks like at that time but it was like almost like an ego death wasn’t it because you had that all of the masks that were.

21:41.16
Troy Hammond
Um, now it’s there right now. Yeah, so now yeah.

21:52.71
katrinamcollier
Keeping you stuck and you blasted through it by going Actually everything will be okay like like keep almost gave yourself permission. Yeah.

21:55.62
Troy Hammond
100% and and that’s what it is now and now yeah and so now anytime I feel like there’s a moment of anxiety where I’m going to wear my mask where I’m going to do things I just run towards it you know and I just say.

22:07.69
katrinamcollier
Like and yeah and just be curious about it in a yeah.

22:11.99
Troy Hammond
Umm, just going to run run towards that and fix that or look at that off see what’s going over there. Um, and you know 9.9 times thattained. Yeah, it’s usually nothing right? It’s usually nothing and and if I fix little things really quickly and iterate on my life. You know like get the.

22:27.24
katrinamcollier
Martin.

22:29.60
Troy Hammond
The thing sorted quickly and move on it becomes no big deal at all and now yeah now I I feel weightless I feel I’m very open about it. You know I think I post about it all the time. Yeah, which is I had about 50 to 60 people.

22:32.00
katrinamcollier
So. Yeah, yeah, which is I saw that post. Yeah, So what that hang on there was something in the the post that you were doing though. Ah did you you had 50 or 60 people.

22:49.17
Troy Hammond
Sorry yeah, I’ve had about 50 to 60 people reach out to me off the back of that post telling me that they’re not okay and um and I’ve said hey let’s just go out for coffee and so I’ve had about 30 or 40 coffees and some people that don’t want to have coffee yet. But I’m just keeping in touch with them. Um, and that’s.

22:58.29
katrinamcollier
Ah.

23:02.60
katrinamcollier
Amazing and are we looking men as well look out. Yeah, because it’s New Zealand Australia England Stiff Upper Lip you know don’t speak.

23:07.46
Troy Hammond
Like so I would say mostly mostly men mostly men but about thirty thirty percent women yeah

23:22.25
katrinamcollier
Shush don’t cry wrote we’ve got so much generational trauma I am so glad that they have got in touch with you and that you’re giving them that space to speak up. That’s amazing now in that post you were talking about was it boxing. You have to remind me.

23:29.98
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah, and I think.

23:36.63
Troy Hammond
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, boxing.

23:39.84
katrinamcollier
Note yourself, don’t podcast recording this late even if you are in New Zealand so it’s any topic I could do it make my brain work.

23:44.57
Troy Hammond
Yeah, now there’s ah, there’s an amazing charity over here charity fight night here called it t heavy hitters and it came about a friend of mine Mike Dawes runs it. He’s his friend unfortunately committed suicide. Um, and so he.

23:53.13
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

24:01.72
katrinamcollier
Ah.

24:02.69
Troy Hammond
Realize that there’s a lot of people in it jobs or in people in jobs where they’re not communicating that well with people who are you’re suffering from depression and unfortunately committing suicide and so there were 606 suicide deaths in New Zealand last year which may not sound a lot but when you think about the size of the population.

24:10.96
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

24:20.41
katrinamcollier
There’s only 4000000 of you aren’t there. That’s insane. Wow wow.

24:22.53
Troy Hammond
Yeah, exactly and so yeah, and so so he set it upon himself to create this boxing event called it heavy hitters and it’s funny when I talk about I talk about it a lot boxing and people will ask Oh I couldn’t do that and I’m like yeah but.

24:34.44
katrinamcollier
Yeah, and.

24:39.85
Troy Hammond
The boxing fight night is just the cherry on top is the reality the the real fire is turning up on the very first day of boxing training camp. You know if you can turn up on that you’ve already won because like in my situation I was unfit. You know I was smoking cigarettes drinking a lot too much at the time and I thought I can’t do this.

24:43.40
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

24:58.30
katrinamcollier
Ah, yes.

24:59.43
Troy Hammond
And Mike just kept texting me going. Oh my you’re going to love it. You’ll you’ll love it and so then I turned up on day one and you look around the room and there’s everyone like you people that are unfit or people that are introverted and haven’t spoken a long time and you all do this really hard stuff together and it it just you you watch people.

25:01.20
katrinamcollier
Here.

25:06.83
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

25:19.12
Troy Hammond
Like you watch you, You’re going. You’re sparring with someone and you’re punching it in the face and then afterwards they’re coming out and they’re giving you the most massive hug and they’re like oh man that was so much fun. You know that was that was awesome. Let’s go and get a copy after this and and you see these people that are just awakening themselves. You know through this like archaic primitive.

25:20.46
katrinamcollier
Um.

25:27.21
katrinamcollier
The.

25:37.90
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

25:38.74
Troy Hammond
Process but what it’s doing is it’s showing them that they they have some power to push past this moment you know in their times and and then as you get fitter. You know the the more physically stronger. You are the more mentally stronger that you can be and so wealth.

25:44.85
katrinamcollier
Yeah, the cardio fool. Yeah.

25:54.80
Troy Hammond
The end of the process. Not everyone gets a fight because they really so make sure that they’re safer and who’s got the right skills and and comparing people up that you know I’m going to hurt each other and so only about 30% of people who go through the training can’t get a fight but the people that go through that some my best friends today because know we so we shared a bond that was phenomenal and so.

25:59.94
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

26:11.30
katrinamcollier
Yeah, what was it like talk about that first day, let’s encourage some people to turn up how did you feel like when you you know the heavy smoking heavy drinking overweight like I finally turned up.

26:13.13
Troy Hammond
Yeah, it’s um I.

26:21.90
Troy Hammond
Ah, so I’ll tell so I’ll tell you. But yeah so I’ll tell you but so six so I’ll so I’ll start six weeks before right because I thought I can’t go I can’t go to a training can’t like that in the shape that I mean.

26:28.20
katrinamcollier
What was going through your head as you walked in the door. Ah, okay.

26:38.21
Troy Hammond
So I’m going to start running and I’m gonna and I’m Goingnna get super fits so when I get there I’m going to be fit and ready to go and then now this is the end this is ah now this was like before actually and so yeah, and yeah I I gonna I’m gonna start running and then um.

26:40.82
katrinamcollier
Is this after the half marathon this is like later than the. Oh okay, okay.

26:56.33
Troy Hammond
I actually was a year later story. It was a year later so then I um and when I say I did a half marathon I did a half marathon but I was not in any shape and you know like it wasn’t that you know um I rolled down the hill pretty much. Yeah, yeah, yeah, then I started six weeks before and.

26:57.10
katrinamcollier
Okay, yeah.

27:06.45
katrinamcollier
Ah, mental strength.

27:13.29
katrinamcollier
Ah, yeah.

27:15.85
Troy Hammond
Going to run so I got to set up at 5 got a fiverr and oneing started running and that lasted about four days and then I quit that because that was too hard. You know? And yeah, yeah, so then I started smoking and start drinking and thinking. Ah I’m not I’m not going to go to this thing and then then.

27:18.85
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, because that’s too effigli. That’s why. But. Ah, yeah, yeah.

27:34.56
Troy Hammond
The night before Mike Door’s text mini was like hey man it’s um so it’s a 5 am start tomorrow I’ve told everyone you’re coming and I was a but and then so yeah I jumped in my car.

27:43.68
katrinamcollier
Um, ah no.

27:47.35
katrinamcollier
Ah.

27:50.44
Troy Hammond
I got there I had hardly had any sleep because I was really worried about it and freaking out. Um, and then we got there and we sat around and just talked for like 20 minutes first and and then they told us what it was going to be like and then they then proceeded to put me through probably the hardest hour and a half.

27:52.32
katrinamcollier
Yeah, no, no.

28:02.82
katrinamcollier
Ah.

28:09.52
Troy Hammond
Session I’ve ever been through my life where I was like you didn’t get time to think because you just had to get straight into it and that was their processes that get you working really hard. Um, show you one of the hardest sessions first and then at the end of it. They said to us all you can do this now.

28:16.80
katrinamcollier
Um.

28:20.99
katrinamcollier
Um.

28:25.89
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

28:26.68
Troy Hammond
You’ve just proved to us that you can do this because you’ve just done a really hard like we were doing like work punching a bag as hard as we could for 5 minutes and then getting down doing a hundred perpes and then getting up painting the bag again running around the block 2 times punching. Yeah, it was like.

28:35.19
katrinamcollier
Oh my God Oh ah.

28:41.32
Troy Hammond
Constant and you’d see these crossbit. 1 ne’s that had obviously done some work before that were in the group that were running ahead of you and but you saw other people just come up to each other and like people would just say keep going like as soon as you get your arms would be so heavy that you’d stop throwing punches. But then someone come up to you and say you can do a draw or I’d say to someone and.

28:54.14
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

29:00.30
Troy Hammond
And you support each other and then at the end of that very first session you give you get this self-belief that you’re like maybe I can do this, you know maybe I can do this. It’s not I know anymore. It’s a maybe and then maybe not but I’m on the maybe side and then.

29:02.76
katrinamcollier
Ah, finalize.

29:08.31
katrinamcollier
And yeah, um.

29:15.11
Troy Hammond
After about two weeks of just continuing to show up every day then you’re like maybe yes I can do this and once you push past that maybe to maybe zest yes, zone in anything you do that a fire in you comes alive you know and then you realize that you can do anything want.

29:27.85
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah, and so how all of the anxiety is gone Well most of the anxiety is gone Now you’re curious if you get some but like you’re not having any panic attacks or like now it.

29:39.95
Troy Hammond
No never have I’ve never had a pan attack since that Lsd session since I definitely have I definitely have a moments. Yeah since ah since the Lsd session I haven’t had a panic attack since but I yeah and yeah, but what.

29:48.50
katrinamcollier
Ah.

29:52.30
katrinamcollier
Okay, and again people please don’t do that in that amount at home unsupervised. There are professionals one can go and see for that caveat caveat caveat. Ah.

29:59.22
Troy Hammond
But yeah, you can do it with that drugs and I think what it is is that you get to a place.

30:04.52
katrinamcollier
And yeah, but it does help with the with the my understanding from the psychedelics as far as the ones that they’re doing the microdosing the research to know these experiences it does help particularly we childhood trauma kids who’ve just got so many layers up it just helps that we can get through.

30:22.70
Troy Hammond
You know? Yeah um I and that’s that it’s proving everywhere and like there’s yeah, there’s a good documentary on Netflix change your mind I think it is if you want to learn more about it. But now I I get anxious feelings now and I get.

30:23.98
katrinamcollier
And start the healing faster. So but better. Do it supervised.

30:37.56
katrinamcollier
And ah is a mainland.

30:39.70
Troy Hammond
Things come on with like I can feel anxiety come on but what I do now is I Just I think of it as a thing now and I just put it over there and and I’m going to I’m going to put that over there and I’m going to run towards the thing that’s making me feel anxious now and I think because it’s because I’m a lot clearer in my head now.

30:41.81
katrinamcollier
That. Yeah, yeah.

30:55.91
katrinamcollier
Yeah, um.

30:58.82
Troy Hammond
I Understand why I’m feeling anxious like I know what the thing is that’s making me anxious beforehand because I had so many masks on and I was just weighed down with so much shame and guilt and stress I couldn’t decipher. What was the thing at the time that was making me anxious but now because I can I run straight towards that and.

31:10.79
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

31:18.56
Troy Hammond
And a lot of a lot of the time that’s um, if you if you fuck up and something like if you make a mistake I go oh Katrina I’m so sorry I screwed this up. Um, you know like I should have done better on this and you know and then 9 times out of 10 You’ll say it’s okay, you know we can fix it. You know and.

31:30.13
katrinamcollier
Ah, and.

31:37.51
Troy Hammond
And so many people just don’t get that like they don’t get run towards problems like don’t be scared of like saying sorry don’t be scared of just saying ah stuff this one up and because what it does is it just yeah yeah and and a lot like a lot of people up.

31:37.76
katrinamcollier
It? Whatever Yeah, um.

31:46.70
katrinamcollier
Yeah, and now I’m going to learn and not do it again? Yeah, but I think it’s again, it’s hard as Well. If you’ve grown up in a house like I did where you know I was pretty well scared to breathe. You know there was always a repercussion. It takes a really long time to get to that point where you kind of go. Okay I made a mistake. Whatever moving on it’s and it is liberating isn’t it when you get there and you just like okay.

32:07.67
Troy Hammond
Um, yeah, yeah, but it does but it’s not just childhood of trauma right? like a lot of people listening to this probably thinking or I have depression and I have anxiety and I didn’t feel any either and.

32:16.22
katrinamcollier
Um.

32:20.68
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, no yeah.

32:21.97
Troy Hammond
I’m reminded of like I watched that Robbie Williams documentary if you’ve seen that? yeah on Netflix you know like the guy it it is phenomenal, phenomenal like he is the most open authentic, amazing person after watching that documentary he he details. Like his battle with depression and anxiety and he would get panic attacks up on stage and um and so can happen to anyone you know and it’s not until you understand why you know and do the work on trying to figure out what’s what the problem is that you can get past it.

32:40.93
katrinamcollier
Yeah, um, yeah, yeah, you gonna say that. That’s very true I shouldn’t say it’s just child trauma I mean it can be things like abandonment as well. But it can also be in the gene pool like can can be in your Dna. Um, it didn’t start with you the book by Mark Wallen is fascinating read for that. How it can come down like even from your grandparents.

33:10.42
Troy Hammond
Yeah, well my daughter, my daughter gets anxiety and panic attacks and so I have to teach her how to deal with those and she hasn’t she’s she’s 1415 and 15 Um, she hasn’t had a hard life. She’s had a great life but she just.

33:10.45
katrinamcollier
2 people and they’re totally impacted on what their grandparents experienced. It’s mind blowing. Yeah yeah, the.

33:27.73
Troy Hammond
Unfortunately, it’s part of her Dna and so I have to like teach her how to deal with those and it’s it’s challenging because so my ex life. Um, when we first separated her panic attacks are probably because of our separation if anything. Um she couldn’t understand her panic attacks.

33:28.17
katrinamcollier
Edits And yeah. So.

33:41.60
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

33:45.56
Troy Hammond
And just she she would say to her you know, look go over it type thing you know like you’re just you’re just being a kid you know and and I was oh actually you know she’s denied. She’s having full on anxiety attacks. You know these are these are hard and so.

33:48.58
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

33:56.84
katrinamcollier
And would that be like your top piece of advice for somebody like if you just understand this is a process like it that sounds wrong. It’s a thing that they’re going to get through like with the panic attack for someone who’s not experienced someone having them What would be your.

34:14.68
Troy Hammond
Yeah, if you if you if you if there’s someone in your life. That’s having a panic attack. Um and and full on like panic attacks vary in nature right? So my panic attacks and my daughter’s panic attacks unfortunately are.

34:15.91
katrinamcollier
And advice.

34:25.79
katrinamcollier
Um.

34:28.49
katrinamcollier
The breathing and.

34:29.17
Troy Hammond
Breath related. So we feel like we’re dying you know and so breathing and short breath and sweating. Um they are real. You know they are debilitating and if you know someone that’s going through the best thing that you can do is you can just sit down and be really calm in your voice and you just talk to them.

34:35.85
katrinamcollier
So yeah, yeah.

34:47.41
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

34:48.32
Troy Hammond
And you don’t talk about the anxiety. You don’t talk about that thing. You talk about anything else and so with my daughter like every 14 year old girl at the moment. It’s Taylor Swift and so I might sit down and just talk to her about the Taylor Swift concert that we’re going to in February and I wonder if our seats are going to be good or if I wonder if our angle we’re going to be able to see this song and.

35:03.13
katrinamcollier
Yeah, ah, that’s amazing.

35:07.98
Troy Hammond
And then all of a sudden I can see her eyes start to come back to me you know and she’s thinking about Taylor Swift which is taking her away from her panic and it gets to the point where she starts coming down then we just keep talking about Taylor Swift for the next five to ten minutes until she’s completely forgotten that she’s had a panic attack and so that’s.

35:23.85
katrinamcollier
That’s amazing. But that’s such brilliant advice. Yeah, but that’s brilliant but I’ve never seen someone have one I wouldn’t know what to do? So Actually thank you for that because then I will know what do so I Really appreciate that.

35:27.15
Troy Hammond
That’s in my experience the best way to help someone throat. Yeah because it’s good.

35:38.67
Troy Hammond
Yeah I’ve I’ve called the ambulance. Um for myself 3 or 4 times and you know like it’s thinking that I was going to die? Yeah yeah.

35:40.22
katrinamcollier
Um.

35:44.10
katrinamcollier
Well I’m glad you didn’t because you’re still one of my top people aren I um, if people would like to get in contact with you to hear more particularly perhaps if they’re in New Zealand and we’re not talking about the castro obviously because you’re in Auckland um, but if people want to get in touch.

35:57.38
Troy Hammond
I mean I’m gonna clean that cast out there.

36:03.20
katrinamcollier
But yeah, it’s got a lock on it. Um, what’s the easiest. What’s your preference for people to get in touch. Do you want it through work or through Linkedin or what would you prefer or they not get in touch. It can tell people not to get in touch. Ah.

36:09.37
Troy Hammond
Yeah, yeah, Linkedin or Linkedin Linkedin know Instagram yeah jump jump on and send me a message on Linkedin or Instagram I don’t really post much I used to be across everything and then I’m I’m very protective of my energy and my time now and so um.

36:20.15
katrinamcollier
Awesome.

36:26.42
katrinamcollier
A.

36:28.89
Troy Hammond
If you get if you do messageaging me on Linkedin you’ll get an outof office reply straight away that says hey I don’t really check this this that much and if you message me on Instagram may not look. But yeah I may not look at it straight away. But I I have po moments a week now where I sort of check in and have a look at those messages and so.

36:31.38
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, that made me laugh.

36:43.17
katrinamcollier
I love that all of that Troy thank you? So so much for your openness and your honesty I really appreciate it. Thank you absolutely absolutely.

36:45.54
Troy Hammond
Or if you see me in the street just come and say hello.

36:53.55
Troy Hammond
So my pleasure I think the best thing that you can do is talk about this stuff.