Ep. 14: Recover, Reconnect & Rise with Jasmine Mbye

 

Unedited transcript: Jasmine Mbye

00:01.51
katrinamcollier
Jasmine Mbye. Thank you so much for coming on Beyond the Damage of Words podcast is such a thrill to have you here? Um I I didn’t do any preamble I just get on launching big question. What led you into healing what started your journey into changing how you felt.

00:17.20
Jasmine Mbye
Good question. Firstly thank you for having me here. Um, and what led me to undergo. What was actually a really long very protracted healing Journey was um as at University they are.

00:18.95
katrinamcollier
Oh so welcome.

00:31.72
katrinamcollier
Um, they are aren’t they yeah.

00:33.90
Jasmine Mbye
Um I was at University and I just realized I was dysfunctional. Um I would act I’m in my room all by myself. You know, listening to my music. Whatever I’m doing and someone rings up and act like I’m so busy I know I’m really busy yet.

00:48.72
katrinamcollier
Um.

00:52.29
Jasmine Mbye
Busy by myself doing what I should have been studying I wasn’t even studying. Um I would be amongst my friends at the time and you know I had lived on campus had great relationships with people and I distinctly remember 1 day sitting amongst these people that I called friends we’d cook food for 1 another invite each other around.

01:06.19
katrinamcollier
Then.

01:10.56
Jasmine Mbye
And I felt lonely because I had built such walls around me to protect me from being hurt that I could be amongst people that I really liked and who I didn’t think had any agenda or anything against me and I would still feel lonely. Um I realized I just couldn’t process my emotions.

01:11.27
katrinamcollier
Wow! what.

01:30.55
Jasmine Mbye
Um, and it’s because I was away from my home environment as I might used the word I was living on campus so this is me now as I am I’m not being what I need to be because I’m trying to survive I’m just being who I am and that’s when I realized um, saying you know you can take the person out so and-. So so you know but you can’t take the so and so out of them.

01:30.99
katrinamcollier
Ah ha.

01:33.56
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

01:43.70
katrinamcollier
Um, and.

01:47.33
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

01:48.82
Jasmine Mbye
In this case, you can take me out of the traumatic environment but the trauma you can’t just take out of me like that you have to work that stuff out and so I realize I don’t function.

01:55.26
katrinamcollier
What did that feel like that feeling of you So you’re in a room with all of these people and feeling lonely. What does that can you describe what that felt like I know that’s a toughie isn’t it and I think that would really resonate with people.

02:05.32
Jasmine Mbye
Oh gosh. Yeah, just I remember sitting there and I think it’s just like just that feeling of disconnect like I’m just I’m not I’m not connected to you and I couldn’t quite understand.

02:18.73
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

02:24.96
Jasmine Mbye
Why I can’t feel you that’s it I can’t feel you the way that I want to feel you I’m here you’re there, We’re laughing. We’re joking. We’re having a great time but I still can’t feel you That’s it no connection I can’t feel you.

02:26.25
katrinamcollier
Now.

02:37.18
katrinamcollier
That’s no bond. No bond. Yeah.

02:43.22
Jasmine Mbye
And it’s because I have walls around me and those walls are so thick. Um, and yeah I just feel so alone.

02:44.35
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

02:51.70
katrinamcollier
It’s interesting. You say that because um I know that we have similar Well there’s stuff isn’t there childhood stuff. Um, it’s interesting because you can dissociate through memory loss which is what I’ve done or what you’re talking about that feeling like you’re just not necessarily feeling.

02:55.64
Jasmine Mbye
We here take.

03:01.82
Jasmine Mbye
I think I learned that you numb yeah numb yourself numb I need to numb myself to survive because if I feel I might feel like die in I might realize I feel like a lot of negative stuff. So let me just not feel.

03:08.65
katrinamcollier
Numb that? Yeah yeah I could be hurt. Um.

03:18.60
Jasmine Mbye
So that I can get through them that was part of my coping strategy just don’t feel just don’t feel. Um and again a University you know first year I’m out and I’m just being myself now and then people go to be oh jazz. You know you’re really hard and like go No I’m not I’m strong. But oh oh yeah, yeah, yeah, strong strong and then I really.

03:28.80
katrinamcollier
Um.

03:37.68
Jasmine Mbye
The first word that everyone used to describe me was not strong. It was hard I was trying to be strong because I need to survive so I need to be strong. But again it’s the walls that I’m building is actually a such defense that now I’m coming across as hard and quite cold and I remember someone actually.

03:40.72
katrinamcollier
Hot. Yeah.

03:52.20
katrinamcollier
New and.

03:55.44
Jasmine Mbye
Called me out one day I said oh yeah, people think I’m cold and them it. No, if people don’t think you’re cold I think you’re hot because they called my friend. They said she’s cold. That’s we think she but they think your hard.. There’s difference is it because with you they know that they’ve got to probably get through a jungle. But if they get through the jungle there’s warmth there with your friend. We’re not so sure like. And it was like oh my gosh This guy’s actually able to recognize a difference between someone who comes off as being cold and me I’m not perceived as cold people know that there’s something more there but I’m just very protective I’m therefore hard and so all of this realization happened at University and I was at that time.

04:14.49
katrinamcollier
Wow Um moment.

04:26.11
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah.

04:32.36
Jasmine Mbye
Only way I could express my feelings was through poetry. So I’d write my feelings down in poem form and which I still have and I’m sure it’s a book to publish one of these days. Um, yeah, yeah, um.

04:37.84
katrinamcollier
Ah, oh how beautiful? Oh yes I would totally be there getting the first copy I’m there. Ah love it.

04:47.95
Jasmine Mbye
And so that’s when I realized like I have been really affected by my childhood like I’m not able to show up in life the way that I want to the way that I think I’m showing up like I think I’m being strong I’m actually not coming across that way I’m coming across as hard. Um, and then I start to go to a church.

04:50.95
katrinamcollier
Here and may.

05:06.18
Jasmine Mbye
And in that church they specialized in a real focus on emotional healing. Um and that for me was just so powerful because it was at a point where I realized I am dysfunctional I don’t know how to be normal quote unquote and I didn’t feel normal. That’s other thing I always had this feeling like.

05:09.58
katrinamcollier
Wow! What’s amazing.

05:23.84
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, no or I have to say it I don’t like hearing you call yourself dysfunctional I mean you were hurt where I know I bet you had to unlearn.

05:24.91
Jasmine Mbye
I Don’t fear something’s wrong with me. That’s the pervasive feeling that I had. That’s what I felt like though. Yeah, but as in it’s It’s not a nice term but that’s what I felt you know I just felt like I can’t I don’t have to function.

05:41.12
katrinamcollier
Yeah I think it’s.

05:43.98
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah I don’t fit I’m crying and I don’t actually I can’t understand why I’m crying sometimes because I’ve learnt to disassociate feelings to statue to degree like I don’t know how to function in a normal healthy way I’m just surviving.

05:49.32
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

05:54.15
katrinamcollier
Um.

05:57.33
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

06:01.36
Jasmine Mbye
And Survival doesn’t feel good. It was church. Oh I can remember the service I’ve done a tedx talk and I think that I share this in my tedx talk and.

06:04.26
katrinamcollier
How how did you open up then what? so you you you went to the church and they but how how how did you trust that? ah.

06:16.96
Jasmine Mbye
It was a church service and it was called like it’s so actually titled even beyond my issues. The woman was called Doctor Wanda Turner and this you can tell it’s imprinted so much in my life I have not forgotten it and she talked about um in the bible. There’s a story of a woman with the issue of blood a woman that kept bleeding.

06:19.16
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

06:26.46
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah.

06:34.71
katrinamcollier
Um.

06:35.49
Jasmine Mbye
Um, and how she managed to get a healing and she was saying that you know it was a women’s conference I do believe as well. She’s saying you know as women we have our issues. Um, but even with them you know God can still touch us. You can still use us. Um and she got us and it was the first time I had ever articulated how I felt.

06:47.83
katrinamcollier
Um.

06:53.92
Jasmine Mbye
She said I want you to connect hands with 2 other people. So remember I said to you I feel this wall around me so I’m holding people’s hands now connect with 2 people and one of them was actually a friend of mine. So at this point in time I’m in my early 20 s because I graduated about 22 so I some about 20 maybe 21 um

06:57.36
katrinamcollier
Yeah, ah sp. Yeah yeah.

07:05.81
katrinamcollier
Oh.

07:12.25
Jasmine Mbye
And I’ve of holding hands with a friend who had invited to church had known me since um I was like my late age of a latter part of my sixteenth year so by this time I’d known me really? well we were friends talked all the time so he was one hand can’t remember who the other person was and were holding hands just and I want you to share.

07:20.16
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

07:31.19
Jasmine Mbye
Your issues. What are those things that you feel in your heart and so for the first time in my life I shared that I feel ugly I feel unlovable I feel unlikable and even to this moment. It makes me feel emotional now because I remember it was the first time that I let my walls down.

07:33.51
katrinamcollier
Oh wow.

07:42.19
katrinamcollier
I’m going.

07:49.60
Jasmine Mbye
And was transparent about the the narrative that pervaded my mind and the feelings that plagued my heart that I’d never shed with a soul had only ever written down in poetry and so this person who thought I know jazz she’s is listening to me describe how I.

07:49.96
katrinamcollier
Um.

07:56.24
katrinamcollier
Um.

08:08.17
Jasmine Mbye
Actually feel about myself and is in total shock.

08:08.35
katrinamcollier
And had they shock but also how did they react because of course they would be shocked because they have a perception I mean the mask that you’d put up so when they saw behind the mask behind the walls. How did they then react.

08:20.93
Jasmine Mbye
Ah, yeah, like.

08:26.81
katrinamcollier
Once they got past the oh, she’s not hard I thought she was.

08:30.69
Jasmine Mbye
It then becomes ah I don’t understand like but you seem so like that questioning wanting to know more to understand which then led me to open up and talk about my childhood experiences that actually yeah.

08:42.00
katrinamcollier
Curious Supportive Want to know more which is not what we expect is that we expect judgment and criticism and disbelief. And yeah.

08:47.30
Jasmine Mbye
And and that’s what was shocked me more no judgment. Yeah, and you’re weak and you’re worthless. That’s why you were treated like that is because oh you’re not worthy of anything. It’s why you’ve been treated like Rubbish um and and this is one of the reasons. Why.

09:00.20
katrinamcollier
Number now.

09:05.49
Jasmine Mbye
You know I do what I do and I encourage people to share their stories because I have found it to be 1 of the scariest thing you can do but feel the fear. Do it anyway because it’s actually 1 of the most empowering things you can do because I have only I’ve only ever found I don’t have actually have ever found any 1

09:09.56
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah I Guess yeah.

09:23.94
Jasmine Mbye
Um, other than for those whom it may touch upon who are like oh you were trying to make me look bad and I’m like that’s not my intention at all. Um other people outsiders Yes, those people in question, you know, ah may have ah questioned my motives and whatever else, but outside of that.

09:27.64
katrinamcollier
Ah.

09:32.99
katrinamcollier
Um, oh you mean your abuser. How are we loving it? Yeah narcissistic.

09:43.63
Jasmine Mbye
And people may be connected to them who just don’t hear what I’m where I’m coming from I’ve only ever had people say Wow like you have gone up in my estimation because to think that you can be the person that you are in spite of everything that you have been through I’m amazed.

09:46.13
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

09:52.85
katrinamcollier
Remember.

09:59.91
katrinamcollier
Yeah, and you know I think that’s why it is so important that we tell our stories. Um, and I said I mean I think on the very first episode when actually Claire Bush interviewed me and I said you know when I’m on stage people really look up me and like wow and it’s like.

10:01.33
Jasmine Mbye
Um, amazed why.

10:04.30
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah I. Members Interview stage.

10:16.60
katrinamcollier
You’ve got to understand how far I’ve come. You know you said something a minute ago about you expected them to say you weren’t worthy and I assume that’s what you were told a lot as a child and therefore it’s It’s like but now I know I am worthy.

10:17.76
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah.

10:28.91
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah, yeah.

10:30.33
katrinamcollier
And it’s that during that journey and if we don’t tell that then how will others also take that journey because you don’t have to stay that but yeah resilient we’re resilient. That’s what we are. Ah, you know.

10:35.85
Jasmine Mbye
There that’s it very resilient and that’s what the thing is well you learn to appreciate yourself like what you can’t see via Zoom is you know I’m a petite woman I’m like five foot 2 and quite small in build. Yeah, very petite but I’ve got a big. Oh so we like.

10:51.36
katrinamcollier
Um, my heart up here Five nine so um

10:55.15
Jasmine Mbye
Always is yeah you know I’ve got a big personality and I’ve always had this voice So I’d get told off for talking and whatever I’ve got a big voice. Um you know, but to to grow up wanting to shrink myself because I just don’t want to get in the way because when you’ve been. What’s made to put like a punch in bag and you’ve had those negative words spoken of you? Oh you make me Sick. You know, um, things that you would never want to hear as a child I Hate you? Um, those are the things that you would not want the people that brought you into this world. Anyone to say to you? um.

11:13.46
katrinamcollier
Down.

11:19.39
katrinamcollier
I.

11:28.98
katrinamcollier
So am I cooked and understanding that person as a narcissist would that be a good description. Do they then? Okay, sorry.

11:31.29
Jasmine Mbye
And to hear that ah I would say ah it’s whether I’d say Narcissist not sure to be quite honest. Ah it’s not something I’ve I’ve considered enough but it’s that kind of hurt dogs bite.

11:44.23
katrinamcollier
Um.

11:49.95
Jasmine Mbye
And so when you’ve been abused you then often either go on to be an abuser or to be abused yourself and it was a repetition of the cycle and it’s a cycle that I have um exactly that I have like been very deliberate into this needs to break and so yeah.

11:50.58
katrinamcollier
Yeah, that to yeah yeah, ah generation of Roma ended good.

12:08.59
Jasmine Mbye
You know the abuse had been and and and I think more you know not to compare. But you know literally when you hear the stories and the trauma that um you know has been undergone I’m like it’s it’s unsurprising Unfortunately that I would go through what I’ve been through when I you know? yeah.

12:09.30
katrinamcollier
Wills run.

12:13.85
katrinamcollier
Who.

12:24.12
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah I think what you’re saying is I have no it doesn’t make it okay and I had to look at that form. The reason my mum was an abuser So I’m an narcissistic abuser and my father the enabler which is also is damaging you know abandoning.

12:27.33
Jasmine Mbye
Know the story doesn’t make it. Okay.

12:36.24
Jasmine Mbye
A Wow they’ in bading. Yeah I needed why they were the way. Yeah, it helps and yeah I understand why they.

12:40.65
katrinamcollier
Physically there and abandoning but it was like I needed to look at why they were the way they were to forgive them for myself not to physically call and forgive them just for me to let it go because I understand why they were the way they were. It doesn’t make it right? doesn’t lessen what we went through. It’s just it’s like.

12:54.89
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah, no, it’s just like really does whereas I’m the opposite to you I’ve always been and this is where I’ve had to learn balance in in later life. You know as the gray hairs appear.

12:59.34
katrinamcollier
That really helps doesn’t it. It just sort of fun that when you get to the point because it takes it took a while to get there. So.

13:14.76
Jasmine Mbye
Because um I was always aware of what mom had been through. Oh I’ve died it I’ve died it Trust me. Oh.

13:17.80
katrinamcollier
Get out of town. You’re still in your twenty s I’m when done today. It’s like very short today. Ah thank you.

13:24.59
Jasmine Mbye
I Love it I used to have short relaxed hair was one of my favorite styles before I’ve got locks. You can’t probably see them now before starting my natural hair journey. Um, but I was always aware of what my mom had been through and had immense compassion for her but to my own detriment.

13:28.55
katrinamcollier
I Think amazing.

13:36.51
katrinamcollier
Well yes, no boundaries 1

13:39.67
Jasmine Mbye
And so that meant I learnt growing up to put my feeling second because I knew the pain that she was going through exactly that and so it’s meant that I’ve then got into unhealthy relationships because I’ve learned to put other people’s feelings first understand their pain and undermine my own.

13:52.73
katrinamcollier
Make this long.

13:57.95
Jasmine Mbye
Not and literally to the point where you know later on when having challenging conversations about what I’ve been through. Um when it’s questioned. What are you talking about? why are you making it out to be so bad I’m not making it out to be I don’t need to make the story up. It doesn’t benefit me.

14:04.98
katrinamcollier
Are out.

14:13.82
katrinamcollier
And and again.

14:17.46
Jasmine Mbye
To imagine that I’ve been a broken beaten abused child and it doesn’t I don’t get anything from that I don’t get high from that. Um, but that’s what my story incorporates. Um, yeah, and and that for me I think was the biggest struggle.

14:23.44
katrinamcollier
Um, my that really resonates really and I’m writing it in a book. Yeah.

14:35.37
Jasmine Mbye
The anger How can you hurt me so badly and in my my my love and shield for you I’m I’m not allowing you to see how much you hurt me because I know you’re hurting and then when I do speak up is actually you’re hurting me, you’re like what what are you talking about and this like excuse me.

14:39.64
katrinamcollier
In collya.

14:53.50
Jasmine Mbye
Excuse me, It’s very painful.

14:53.32
katrinamcollier
Yeah, and that Den Nile is it’s tough and they close up the closer I’m getting to like it’s it’s written like I’m ah you know I’m nearly there I’ve got like 3 quarterters of a chapter to go and it’s like you know I’m a bat to put it. Yeah but I know what you mean because I have.

15:00.78
Jasmine Mbye
Wow Oh Wow I give it.

15:09.68
katrinamcollier
Well one one family member’s gone very quiet but I’m sure he’ll come. He’ll be fine, but there’s another who I know is doing what you’re talking about that. Oh this isn’t true because they didn’t see that side of this person because it it and and I know what you mean and it’s like they start.

15:19.26
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah Ha ha.

15:26.64
katrinamcollier
Questioning your reality and that’s hard. Yeah.

15:27.47
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah, that’s really painful. That’s really painful and I think for me, that’s the most painful thing to have undergone all that pain and you have caused me to then turn around and basically call me a liar is extremely hurtful.

15:35.92
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

15:44.15
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

15:45.86
Jasmine Mbye
Extremely helpful to the point where I’m like I need to go and find some records I know my truth and I will speak my truth I don’t do so maliciously I do so because I believe we all need to be free and part of that is this is my story as I think Michelle Obama says that your story is what you own and it’s all you’ll ever have.

15:52.40
katrinamcollier
Um, no yeah, yeah.

16:04.90
Jasmine Mbye
So own it basically and that’s what I have deliberately decided to do not to feel ashamed of it but just to own it is mine. Um and to share it without malice without hatred but to share it because it’s my truth to share. Um, but when that’s yeah when that’s undermined. Um.

16:12.61
katrinamcollier
Um.

16:21.91
katrinamcollier
Um, one.

16:22.99
Jasmine Mbye
And question to the point where I’m um I am being called a liar that’s hurtful and it’s to the point where I’m like actually um, you know what? I think I’m going to go and try and get some doctors records because in school records because um I’m I’m sure there is some evidence to verify what I I am saying here. Yeah.

16:28.80
katrinamcollier
Um, ah.

16:34.80
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah is totally evidence. Yeah I found that I actually it was quite funny because I was sort of handed all of my childhood photos at 1 point. But before that I had been handed my report card from school. Which also said I talked a lot so hard to believe um bit. I was I just remember being bored I’m not surprised I talked a lot but because I was shushed at home. So I’m not surprised I talked at school but it did say like there was there were threads there are words in there that show that there was stuff going on at home a bit back in the 70 s and eighty s I mean the teachers couldn’t do much sadly, it was different.

17:06.39
Jasmine Mbye
It was different. It was a different world wasn’t it then? yeah.

17:10.66
katrinamcollier
Did you did you find when you were doubted I mean on top of I’m sure at moments made you doubt yourself, but did it stop you from continuing the healing work or did it make you almost more determined because it’s like look I know this is what I’ve been through so I’m going to continue.

17:25.98
Jasmine Mbye
Um I had already done much of my healing work by this point. Um because my healing journey I’d say I spent practically my whole 20 s healing um as much as I could because I do think you wear onions.

17:30.31
katrinamcollier
That’s good.

17:36.71
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

17:38.20
Jasmine Mbye
And so there’s stuff that I’m healing from now and I’m like God I didn’t even realize I had that issue so another one to add to the Li you know and it’s like because you peel back one lane it just reveals something else. Another bit of um damage that you’ve incurred as a result of that you weren’t aware of and you couldn’t be aware of because you had something greater to deal with at that time.

17:43.73
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, um, go with.

17:56.56
katrinamcollier
Um, and ah yeah.

17:57.23
Jasmine Mbye
So um, I’d say that bulk of my healing took place in my twenty s um, um when I started to talk about things wasn’t until I was in my late thirty s yeah so we’re talking about and it it does add an extra layer.

18:07.11
katrinamcollier
Um, but you did you try a different. Did you try a different healing Modal or was it whoop Sorry I I think I just stood on my dog in case, most beautiful times he was snoring and Im sure and now he’s being whiny. Um.

18:18.00
Jasmine Mbye
Oh dear.

18:26.92
katrinamcollier
Did you try a different healing modality at that time when you got to the late 30 s like what happened then and.

18:32.15
Jasmine Mbye
No, it was um, just a conscious decision. Um, after realizing that as much as I’d done a lot of work in my twenty s the area that I hadn’t recognized and it’s because I wasn’t in a committed relationship at the time that I’d spent.

18:43.29
katrinamcollier
Um, I mean.

18:48.62
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

18:49.68
Jasmine Mbye
I’d had some relationships but spent a lot of time single and I think part of that’s because obviously guarding your heart um got into a relationship and then realized ah exactly that’s the safest place isn’t it keep them out. Um, realizing that I’ve married a replica and that was ah.

18:56.53
katrinamcollier
I’m not letting anyone in. Yeah. In here.

19:08.48
Jasmine Mbye
Oh my God What have I done I thought I’d healed and I realized I haven’t addressed relationships and the template I didn’t realize that the template we get in childhood is the one that we typically follow into adulthood.

19:11.13
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, and.

19:16.29
katrinamcollier
Oh. Oh yes.

19:25.42
Jasmine Mbye
And I’d never undergone any counseling So any like official therapies. Um, my issue has always been I’m too I’m too good at coppa I don’t get depressed enough so I’m not ever clinically depressed I’m a like functioning depressive person when I do have my depressive episodes.

19:27.28
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

19:38.11
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah.

19:45.22
Jasmine Mbye
And so I’ve never qualified as depressed and I’ve never thought okay I’m going to pay for it lich until ah more recent I thought right? that’s it I’m actually going to pay and I’m going to get some counseling because I deserve that and I don’t feel. It’s a case of I’m in a such a bad place I need it per se but I want it? um and I want to just.

19:50.30
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, absolutely.

19:59.81
katrinamcollier
Um, but you deserve it. You deserve it. It’s yeah so funny I Um I wrote about in the book that um on my memoir I should say because I do have another book. Um I remember I Probably this is a more hilarious.

20:04.79
Jasmine Mbye
Allow that? Yeah allow whatever is that can come from that to come from it. So yeah.

20:19.66
katrinamcollier
Thing that current my so oop sorry won say no, my sister and I were absolutely blind rotten drunk sitting out at the back of her house and I had to start laughing my head off and I went oh my god mom dad me Richard you and your husband oh my god look what we’ve done. We’ve emulated her. We don’t even like her and we’ve done exactly the same thing with this and bless her. She started sobbing a little heart out because she’s in the middle of going through it and I’m out the other side and now really good friends with my ex-husband we’re like siblings but it was. We’ve used that pattern like ah I mean well done youth.

20:40.30
Jasmine Mbye
And Molesta she’s started stop and go a little harder out.

20:48.38
Jasmine Mbye
Relax it is I don’t think they do.

20:55.14
katrinamcollier
Rising that pattern because I don’t think people do and I should say hand on Heart You know I’m writing this as a single woman who’s been single for quite a period of time by choice and I know that an addition too when I kind of go into relationship and have to face other stuff that still comes up the patterns that come up and you go.

21:04.95
Jasmine Mbye
Apply period time by Toy Just say when.

21:12.65
Jasmine Mbye
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, and that that’s what really kind of made me think well I need to start speaking my truth I need to start speaking my truth because up until that point I I.

21:15.12
katrinamcollier
Nope. Nope. Nope. So yeah I I feel you.

21:23.50
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

21:29.19
Jasmine Mbye
Ah, would always skirt around it last night said my business was talking about like empowerment and you wanted to inspire women but then um, really wouldn’t share. Can you hear me can you hear me? Okay, yeah, and I said it’s lost connection for a minute there. Um, yeah has a little moment.

21:31.36
katrinamcollier
Um.

21:35.49
katrinamcollier
Yen Millian and

21:41.60
katrinamcollier
I can hear you yeah know ah I leave by the way I leave all the blerches in as well. This is the most rough podcast almost like I.

21:47.49
Jasmine Mbye
Um I need all the books.

21:51.14
Jasmine Mbye
Do I think people like when things are rough around it is because they connect more. So yeah, and that’s my.

21:57.39
katrinamcollier
Like oh ah, this is what it feels like when I’m on a Zoom and suddenly you don’t know if you’re talking to yourself. But anyway be here. Yeah.

22:02.81
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah, um I realized in my business that I was still wearing this mask I was still wearing this mask I want to seem so together and I’m Jasmine Mbye and I figured it all out and life is good and look at me and Dada Dada and it’s like actually you know what I’m tired of it I’m tired of the mask I’m tired of pretending.

22:10.98
katrinamcollier
Um, um, um, yeah, energy just to keep mask up is just like.

22:20.12
Jasmine Mbye
Um, and life hit rock bottom Yeah and I think if that’s what you’ve done your whole life. It’s what is comfortable doing and it becomes extremely uncomfortable to be authentic. You know, but I just realize.

22:29.89
katrinamcollier
Um, and yeah.

22:35.66
Jasmine Mbye
I I want different and having a daughter helped me immensely because I thought to myself. What am I modeling for her. What do I want her to believe is normal. What do I want to be her her reality because whatever she sees me do that’s what she thinks is normal. What she sees me take.

22:37.12
katrinamcollier
Oh how wonderful yeah and.

22:54.29
Jasmine Mbye
That’s what she thinks a woman’s supposed to take what she sees me not do. That’s what she thinks a woman’s not so I mean I become a benchmark for her a standard and that for me was a real mantle like I took very seriously and it made me think okay jazz you know if this is not okay for you.

22:56.70
katrinamcollier
Um, who yeah.

23:05.70
katrinamcollier
Yeah I mean about more.

23:13.32
Jasmine Mbye
It’s not okay for you and it’s definitely not okay for her and unfortunately as women we are often able to take stuff that we really shouldn’t take when it’s just us. But when somebody else is in the equation particularly little person that will light a different kind of fire in our lives that means we’re able to go? No um.

23:20.90
katrinamcollier
Um, and it.

23:25.77
katrinamcollier
And red. Oh I Love that.

23:31.85
Jasmine Mbye
And I think for me yeah, realizing that I was slowly freedom like I’m dying every day I’m like this is not living this is existing and I don’t want my daughter believe existing is how life is supposed to go. It’s so you’re like ah oh my gosh like you can breathe.

23:37.40
katrinamcollier
Yeah, what did when you let it go when you just went ah did you.

23:51.60
Jasmine Mbye
Please.

23:51.58
katrinamcollier
But did that entail did you lose some people out of your life like I call them putting them on off your bus like did you or did work changed or I know it’s just like got off my bus I socialize people get on. They’re generally like um like ah a soul sister or something and they get on for a bit help you with a bit and they got off.

23:57.65
Jasmine Mbye
I Love that term I and came across that this year it? Yeah um, it.

24:07.34
Jasmine Mbye
He yeah.

24:10.67
katrinamcollier
That’s cool, but other times it’s like could you get off my bus like just is it I know and it’s like it’s so lovely has it been liberating.

24:11.85
Jasmine Mbye
Like yeah eviction.

24:21.20
Jasmine Mbye
It was liberating and for me, um it was a case of right I need to my life fell apart. So I was like right I need to get out of what I’m in um and so literally I just left my relationship with my daughter. Um and we went into a refuge um and that was where I’m like okay.

24:26.50
katrinamcollier
Um.

24:37.41
Jasmine Mbye
I’ve heard of refuges I Never envisaged that in my life I’d be in one but here I am but you know what this is going to be the making of me. It’s not going to be the breaking of me. Um, and that’s why I just I aside I’m I’m gonna I’m gonna be real I’m going to be honest about who I am.

24:40.46
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

24:46.50
katrinamcollier
Man.

24:54.25
katrinamcollier
Amazing.

24:56.23
Jasmine Mbye
About where I am um and you know I ah had enough Diplomatau in the water to know that people actually aren’t as cruel as we imagine them to be when we are open and honest about our story. Um, and the little bit that I had done people felt liberated by so I was like you know what.

25:04.40
katrinamcollier
Um, and.

25:13.50
katrinamcollier
And.

25:16.90
Jasmine Mbye
Think if I just say what needs to be said is only going to liberate people more and liberate more people. Um, and so that was it.

25:19.90
katrinamcollier
Man and it’s funny in those lowest moments you you know you? you clearly you’re like me you see the silver lining it was like okay this is really shocking. This is not where I plan to be I mean my gosh you know, but it’s like okay day one new life here we go I mean you.

25:27.74
Jasmine Mbye
Like yeah, right lines day one.

25:37.32
katrinamcollier
And I feel like that’s almost like you can go. Okay, that’s done now don’t send me another lesson like that. Okay I’ve got it when you live. So how do you now incorporate that into your work because I know that’s also been and when was that by the way because Wow you’ve come a long way fast.

25:40.63
Jasmine Mbye
Let me learn. Yeah, how do you know.

25:50.31
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah, um, and I think it’s because that healing journey in the 20 s it just helped me get a bit of perspective on myself to realize I thought secretly I’m some loser and weak and whatever and I realize you know what you’ve been through a lot and you you.

25:57.83
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah, 5

26:07.48
Jasmine Mbye
Here like you are stronger than you realize so that was a good foundation so that even the lessons that I hadn’t quite learned when I did realize oh damn this is what I’ve got myself into I was like well I’ve got through that I can get through this and I’ve got even more motivation with my daughter. Um.

26:11.42
katrinamcollier
Um, number one? yeah.

26:19.42
katrinamcollier
Yeah, culture was up your right? yeah.

26:24.93
Jasmine Mbye
And just feeling free once I decided actually I’m not going to keep stuff in anymore I’m going to let it out. Um, and there have been challenges along along the line but we’re talking about this was just before the pandemic that my life hit rock bottom but because I was determined that this was going to be the making of me.

26:29.90
katrinamcollier
Um.

26:33.17
katrinamcollier
Of course Wow in.

26:42.95
Jasmine Mbye
And the 1 thing anyone that knows me will tell you I’m a determined woman so when I get my mind onto something and determine that I’m going to do it I’m going to do it and you know that was at the expense of relationships possibly but I was like I I have to be true to me.

26:46.18
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, um, which weight was.

27:00.32
Jasmine Mbye
So if you love me, you will know my heart you will seek to find my heart and you will recognize I’m not speaking Ill will against you I’m just speaking my truth and if that upsets you you are free to leave. But if you want to stick around then you know and and you can respect me in the boundaries that I’m now creating then.

27:05.44
katrinamcollier
Yeah, um.

27:12.71
katrinamcollier
Yeah I mean it’s it’s I mean you call it God from Church I call it universe. You know you’ve you’ve gone from Heart you’ve raised your vibration and.

27:18.47
Jasmine Mbye
We can. We can go forward. Yeah, we attract what we are? yeah.

27:26.62
katrinamcollier
And the reward it comes like you. You’re vibrating up here so in comes the work in comes the house comes everything you need exactly because you brought your vibration. You know what I’m doing this from heart I’m doing this from. Love.

27:37.78
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah, it’s so sorry to.

27:39.28
katrinamcollier
It’s It’s so sad that we we’re so disconnected. It’s like ah one of the things I learnedt writing my memoir was that the vagus nerve runs up gut heart into hedge and we’re trying to operate the other way and actually you’ve gone. No this isn’t right I’m going to heart I’m going to operate from Heart I Mean that’s what I do and it’s just so liberating.

27:50.99
Jasmine Mbye
Um, more sit down. But yeah.

27:55.99
Jasmine Mbye
It really is present like.

27:57.91
katrinamcollier
And then anything that doesn’t resonate. You’re like no I’m not doing that come back over here and then it’s yeah, life is good because it has its moments. It’s life but it’s you know it’s so wonderful. Isn’t it. So how do you incorporate that day to day into the work that you do because you’re inspiring girls aren’t you and and women to I mean.

28:02.98
Jasmine Mbye
And it does like ultimately you’re happy. Yeah. Yeah, so the focus of the business now is initially it was women and girls but because it’s been primarily myself in the business and got a number of people that I do work with but it’s limited number so we’re holding a little bit back on the girls front if I get invited to do stuff. We’ll do it but not proactively.

28:17.70
katrinamcollier
Another really? um, um yeah, so.

28:32.83
Jasmine Mbye
Working with the girls and now the focus is the women um and have shifted actually from working with women in a more um B Two C sense. So like I offer a program. Let’s help you with your life and working with women more in the organizational sense. So as organizations, let’s empower the women that you work with.

28:41.39
katrinamcollier
You know. Yeah.

28:51.13
Jasmine Mbye
Because what I realize is my greatest developments actually occurred whilst I was at work I’d be on training and I remember learning about dealing with difficult customers I’m learning and just getting an understanding about myself and accepting myself I was like this is my personality type. Oh this is not something bad about me. It’s just.

28:54.79
katrinamcollier
You have.

29:04.26
katrinamcollier
Um, yes.

29:09.34
katrinamcollier
Yeah, and and.

29:09.34
Jasmine Mbye
Type of person that I am and everyone has strengths and weaknesses and all this revelation and it just empowering me more and more and more and that just spill over into my personal life So working women professionally.

29:16.85
katrinamcollier
Um, funny So many times through this, you’ve you’ve said you know I’ve called the book the damage of words and it’s like because and you have just said things like oh I’m not that and you would say one of the damaging words that you were told that you were and you’d say and then you it say God they take that moment if you’re going I’m not.

29:24.40
Jasmine Mbye
A.

29:35.97
Jasmine Mbye
I.

29:36.72
katrinamcollier
That I’m not and it’s It’s so lovely to hear that you’ve you’ve you’ve realized like you’ve just realized that you know you are a kind and wonderful human who wants to build other people up I mean it’s yeah, that’s so lovely.

29:41.20
Jasmine Mbye
Before you like yeah.

29:49.48
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah, and and that’s exactly it like we have ah my 3 things we work with women empowering inspiring women who typically wear a mask to overcome obstacles.

29:56.16
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, ah.

30:00.24
Jasmine Mbye
And Pastor Syndrome abuse bullying low self-confidence because sometimes we can’t root it in trauma but we still struggle with confidence. You know that’s what my life has shown me that as women we just seem to question and doubt ourselves so much more even if there isn’t a major reason as to why? so we empower us by women to overcome obstacles to release their potential.

30:02.87
katrinamcollier
I Mean on we that.

30:14.48
katrinamcollier
Um, um, and.

30:20.00
Jasmine Mbye
We have it. It’s about releasing it to release their potential and then to advance in their careers in their businesses and in their lives and we do that with our three R Rec Recover reconnect and Rise and that’s what I got out of my life falling apart when I look back.

30:21.96
katrinamcollier
I’s just letting it out of here. No.

30:33.90
katrinamcollier
I Love that.

30:39.62
Jasmine Mbye
I was like what am I doing what have I done I’m like you know what? the reason I’ve been able to accelerate is because I was working on myself to recover I then worked to reconnect and I was determined to rise. So that’s the 3 pillars of off empowerment method that we work with women to do.

30:40.20
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

30:42.73
katrinamcollier
You I claim.

30:52.87
katrinamcollier
Ah, love it. That’s that is so amazing. What a journey you have been on. It’s interesting I do yeah I do feel as the patriarchy falls. It will be easier for women to feel that they deserve help.

30:58.14
Jasmine Mbye
It has been a real journey.

31:08.65
katrinamcollier
As well because I think there’s still a bit of that you know that we are. You know we’re down aren’t we Yeah, we’re supposed to just take care of it and it’s like but it’s it is changing. It is changing.

31:10.68
Jasmine Mbye
You know we’re supposed to be superwo I ah slight someone was talking about. You know as a mom you know you always feel guilty and I’m like you know I don’t I. Really don’t always feel guilty and I’m like where does this come from a right because you know what I refute this idea that I’m supposed to be superwoman like ah.

31:26.26
katrinamcollier
Hi tracking. Because you can’t be super Woman. You’re human, you can be epping amazing but you know.

31:35.16
Jasmine Mbye
I’m not super woman I am human I have flaws right? like my even my friend because I I used to sing in a choirs. My friend had an event like jasm I want to sing want you to sing and like what do you? But why don’t you sing Alicia key super when I was like you know what? no I’m not singing it because I ain’t no superwoman I’m not going to tell any other woman to believe she is I’m singing it.

31:41.28
katrinamcollier
But oh amazing.

31:51.60
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah know Yeah, no because that almost implies you have to be all things to all people.

31:54.39
Jasmine Mbye
So but I like the song but I was just like now that is not the message that I want to bring because I’m not trying to be so woman I’m not and that just helps to eliminate guilt. Yeah now.

32:05.34
katrinamcollier
Whereas actually if you’re the best version and you like I do feel like now I can well other than brain surgery and shit like that I don’t want to do. But if I set my mind to it I know I can do anything and that’s very different to how I felt growing up actually I was thinking about I was in Guatemala earlier this year and we did this thing we we met into these caves. Oh no, it was amazing. Go there lovedbbed it.

32:10.39
Jasmine Mbye
I Like very different to super Womanman’s syndrome. Wow Yeah yeah, but I was like.

32:25.18
katrinamcollier
We went into these pres and I was like climbing up. Yeah 52 oh I was 51 then but whatever climbing up these boulders in this and I’m just going I would not I would have talked myself out of being able to do that ten years ago five years ago even probably but definitely 10 years and fifteen years ago and it was just to me that is that.

32:29.90
Jasmine Mbye
Look great.

32:34.89
Jasmine Mbye
That of being able to do that and you.

32:44.88
katrinamcollier
I’m amazing to me I don’t have to be to everybody because I can’t be because you just can’t be and I think Superwoman makes you like everyone has got to light me, everyone’s got to be happy. It’s impossible. So yeah m.

32:45.81
Jasmine Mbye
Amazing to me. Yeah to be no.

32:57.45
Jasmine Mbye
Got to please everyone I love that t-shirt that says you know I can’t please all the people all the time. Um, so I can only please one person at time and today in your day I’m like that is my t-shirt up that listen 1 person a day today in your day darlin maybe tomorrow try again.

33:07.36
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, today’s my day. It’s always my day. Ah yeah, it’s boys always my day. Yeah truth.

33:15.44
Jasmine Mbye
But um I learned from a young age I’m someone that has a memory for like quotes and I remember when I used to get my hair relaxed. The first I was in although he is now Oh God What a fallen soul but wisdom can still come from Fallen Souls It was a bill cosby quote which agrees me to mention his name now knowing. The manner of manner is although he has done good things. It’s just such a shame. Um I learned a quote it said um I don’t know the key to success but I know the key to failure is trying to please everybody and that deeply resonated with me and I’m someone that will read that and go oh okay and that.

33:34.24
katrinamcollier
Um, ah yeah.

33:44.88
katrinamcollier
Oh yeah, was.

33:52.43
Jasmine Mbye
That was a nugget that I just stored and I I I learnt that think about 15 or 16 years old so I took that with me and and just learnt this I’m not going to be. Everyone’s cup of tea and that’s okay, so even though I didn’t like myself. Yeah.

33:56.35
katrinamcollier
Wow I Wish I’d learnt that then.

34:05.72
katrinamcollier
People pleases please take notes people pleases paging people pleases please take note. Ah ah God amazing.

34:16.50
Jasmine Mbye
Me I knew that it was okay for other people to not like me because not everyone will do and it’s not my job to try and make everybody. So um, that was very freeing So it’s amazing How we can have this kind of dichotomy of I don’t like myself but I still am.

34:19.73
katrinamcollier
Yeah, ah yeah.

34:31.12
Jasmine Mbye
Able to be okay with you not liking me and knowing that that’s all right? But yeah I’ve got an issue with me so you know we are such like complex human beings. But yeah, the best thing and the best feeling is when you can look in the mirror and be like to know what I am I’m good and.

34:32.81
katrinamcollier
Yeah, no, we are.

34:45.29
katrinamcollier
I’m all right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

34:46.33
Jasmine Mbye
1 thing I would love to share actually before we go is the power and you mentioned that what is it that helped me transition I went to church and that was great, but what was the catalyst oh in shifting my self loathing to self lovinging.

34:53.46
katrinamcollier
Um, and um, yeah.

35:03.11
katrinamcollier
Um, ah yeah.

35:04.51
Jasmine Mbye
Was affirmations me not relying on somebody else to tell me your beautiful jazz. You’re a nice person. You’re kind I wanted that so deeply but realizing that it’s my responsibility to tell myself what it is that I want to believe and I can work on changing those beliefs by.

35:10.78
katrinamcollier
Night My yeah yeah, okay yeah.

35:23.90
Jasmine Mbye
Being persistent and consistent in telling myself what it is that I really want and need to hear that changed my life.

35:28.88
katrinamcollier
Absolutely I had little post-its with I am written on them all over the place and I would I’d look in the mirror and I’d go I am and I’d finish this sentence. Yeah, absolutely amazing. So if people would love to connect with you after this or for any reason what actually.

35:34.60
Jasmine Mbye
That’s the power. That’s it that statement I am yes that is it.

35:47.63
katrinamcollier
I don’t know why I just went oh but anyway I think I’m being distracted by now he’s snoring behind me I have no idea how much of this is coming across the podcast. Um I did try and lock him out and he got in here didn’t he um, if people would like to connect with you and contact you. What’s the easiest is it. Linkedin do you have a website. What’s your preference.

35:49.75
Jasmine Mbye
I.

35:56.90
Jasmine Mbye
Ah, it’s yeah like.

36:05.20
Jasmine Mbye
Yes, I’d say go to Linkedin the web website does exist which is wwwwdot the light me c I see dot org dot u k but it simply’ll be out of date. It will be getting revamped soon? Um, so you can go then connect to me. We got a contact us and I do get that it comes through to me.

36:13.67
katrinamcollier
Perfect. Yeah yeah.

36:22.41
Jasmine Mbye
But the best place is I’d say social media we’re on most platforms so linked in Facebook and Instagram I am on Twitter I done update that all the time so you’ve got me Jasmine Mbye and by the empowerment champion on those platforms and then you’ve got the company the like me see I see.

36:22.64
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, and.

36:32.72
katrinamcollier
Yeah, amazing. It is really interesting how that last one you mentioned is just dying slowly with all that testosterone.

36:40.49
Jasmine Mbye
Ah, the role.

36:48.59
katrinamcollier
Anyway, on that note, thank you so much that was absolutely amazing I appreciate just the the openness and the honesty and ah, just amazing. So thank you so much. Jasmine Mbye.

36:49.36
Jasmine Mbye
Yeah, and ah, thank you.

36:56.23
Jasmine Mbye
Oh thank you for the opportunity and I just love connecting like this and Sharon. So thanks for creating this space.