Ep. 11: Reacting To Thoughts Is A Choice with Tim Roberts

 

Unedited Transcript: Interview with Tim Roberts 

00:00.51
katrinamcollier
Tim Roberts welcome to Beyond The Damage of Words podcast I’m so excited to talk to you? You are one because you’re one of my favourite humans because of the fact we don’t actually speak. We just send signs back and forth to each other of obnoxious signs that people have written. It’s just like I didn’t.

00:15.33
Tim Roberts
We do? Yeah yeah, is it like every time I see a laminated sign I think of Katrina try get a picture of it send it to you.

00:18.23
katrinamcollier
Remember why we started doing that but it makes my day for tamo. Ah, there’s a message from Tim with an obnoxious sign. Ah.

00:29.16
katrinamcollier
I forgot special because they’re usually in bathrooms or’ not aren they say don’t flash paper gal Anyway, it’s all good. It’s all good. So thank you for joining me um, course I know you’ve been on quite a journey. Um, and we’re going to talk about that but look what what made you start the healing process.

00:33.94
Tim Roberts
Yeah.

00:48.95
katrinamcollier
As you know here, we just get on with it. So here we go jumping in.

00:49.50
Tim Roberts
Yeah I like it let’s get straight into it. What made me sat healing process. It’s I describe it as an equation for me which was anxiety plus stress equals severe depression that that was the moment.

00:56.10
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:08.12
Tim Roberts
For me the the big I guess catalyst within that because I’d had anxiety for number years I’d always suffered with stress and I think I’d had depression for a long time and I’d just never vocalized it I’d never asked somebody.

01:13.46
katrinamcollier
And.

01:20.26
katrinamcollier
Captain.

01:21.38
Tim Roberts
The big thing for me is that in 2018 I would call it my anus miabuls is that the right word it was if horrible year. Basically I was in this complete cycle that annna annis Mirabos I’m trying to be clever and say like the yeah the latin title for it. But about I might again not completely wrong. A.

01:27.23
katrinamcollier
Um, oh yeah, what? what? what? What was it called? Oh oh.

01:40.63
Tim Roberts
But so yeah in that year I was in this cycle and ultimately what that was leading me to was suicidal thoughts. So for me I was every day carrying this round of I wanted to die I wanted to kill myself I wasn’t good enough. People are better off without me I’ve made a mess of my life.

01:44.87
katrinamcollier
Um, oh wow.

01:58.65
katrinamcollier
I.

01:58.99
Tim Roberts
And it was hard because that’s not true I’ve I’m happily married I’ve got two billion kids at the time I I was in good employment you know and that that added to that equation of that severe depression because I was in that cycle of asking why me I must be so stupid I’ve got all these things there’s other people worse off than me and I’m suffering from this and.

02:13.00
katrinamcollier
Um, live.

02:17.59
Tim Roberts
So that was the moment really and but and the big reason for that is I don’t know why I mean this was in ah, a cycle where you know sudden a train platform thinking you know when that when that announcement gets made this train does not stop at this platform my head then would say well I could jump under that train. This is an opportunity.

02:20.32
katrinamcollier
Um.

02:27.39
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

02:36.44
Tim Roberts
I’d be in a supermarket or a chemist even with my kids thinking akabi order strong pain killers Coco Mal whatever it might be and I I didn’t want to feel like this yet. That’s what was going. Um, you know famously sat in work and wrote down on a post it note how I could kill myself the lies I could tell to my wife so I didn’t come home for a certain amount of time.

02:40.27
katrinamcollier
Oh my gosh.

02:55.19
katrinamcollier
I.

02:56.29
Tim Roberts
Where I could go the alcohol the pill all that sort of stuff and I don’t know why a particular day in it which was a bad day I had this thought of. This is bullshit I I don’t want to die I have so much to live for I have so much to be grateful for I Want to go home and I want to stop being the miserable solder around my wife and kids you know I was I was spending days in bed. The typical depressive.

03:10.19
katrinamcollier
Yes.

03:20.82
katrinamcollier
Yeah, what does it? What does it feel like what does it feel like is it is that I sort of think of it as like if you were to describe it is it like a black tar. That’s almost. That’s how I always think of it not that I.

03:24.43
Tim Roberts
Really which I think was a culmination of like say I think are depression for lunch time.

03:34.34
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yeah I think I think black tar is a good way. Yeah, it feels like you stuck. It feels like even though you’re in this moment where there might be a lot of vibrant colors and a lot of people around you you feel.

03:40.32
katrinamcollier
Um, say I’ve ever had it actually surprisingly but that’s how I think of it.

03:51.86
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, why Dan.

03:54.25
Tim Roberts
Frozen you feel like you’re not really there in your own head and even in a conversation with somebody I remember went to one of my cousin’s weddings that summer and before I’d decided to get hell and I remember back in the days when I used to smoke.

04:08.48
katrinamcollier
Um.

04:09.61
Tim Roberts
and and I with my wife and kids and me mom dad and all me family there and everything I me Uncle Nobed was there and all the wonderful people in my family as well were there and I went outside for cigarette and and and and I was outside on my own at the hotel I I think I’ve made it work that way people were probably eating the meal and I excuse myself and I’m just being stood outside and thinking.

04:15.43
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

04:27.48
katrinamcollier
Um.

04:28.78
Tim Roberts
I’m here but I’m not this is a great day. What’s wrong with me and and that feeling of like I’ve got to go back inside now and pretend that I’m okay and you know it was that and and that was exhausting I mean anybody listen to this who if Beenns there anything where you’re pretending that you’re okay oh my God It is exhausting.

04:33.72
katrinamcollier
Um, and.

04:39.65
katrinamcollier
It is.

04:46.54
katrinamcollier
Masks heing masks Upwards exhausting.

04:47.48
Tim Roberts
Yeah, and it yeah and the black tar the the darkness the heaviness you know I’d wake up some mornings and just be like I I Just don’t want to get out of bed because I just feel way down with this so that was the trigger when I got to that moment and like say just.

04:56.15
katrinamcollier
Um.

05:04.85
Tim Roberts
Luckily I’m very very lucky I don’t know where that thought came from in that moment I do now I Now know it was my emotional intelligence yet in that moment. It just came from somewhere and luckily that.

05:07.00
katrinamcollier
Um, no.

05:16.80
Tim Roberts
Led me down that you know, ah as as we were trying for I took the step that that’s what made me take the step was that thought of this is bullsh shit I don’t want to feel like this.

05:19.78
katrinamcollier
So yeah, you know, ah as my as anyone who’s going to read my memoir is going to discover my mother’s first husband did suicide and left my eldest brother and sister and then my mother married.

05:31.56
Tim Roberts
Okay, yeah.

05:36.57
katrinamcollier
My father who never really loved her as her first husband did and then had my brother and I and I always say I grew up in the ripple of a suicide so on behalf of everybody in your ripple. Thank you for taking the step instead and also for being here now and sharing this for someone who hears it and goes gosh I feel like that that.

05:42.11
Tim Roberts
Yeah. Oh Thank you.

05:53.72
Tim Roberts
Yet.

05:56.90
katrinamcollier
I I just I That’s all I ever think when I hear that somebody has suicided as I just think of that ripple I wasn’t even direct to descend it. It wasn’t my father and it massively impacted all of us. So thank you for not doing that. Thank you for taking it. So what was it like when you got got to that moment and you went. Okay I got a call got a phone a friend.

06:02.21
Tim Roberts
Yeah.

06:09.29
Tim Roberts
Ah, thank you Katrina.

06:15.87
Tim Roberts
Yeah I am.

06:15.91
katrinamcollier
Um, because I didn’t do that remember So I’m always like I had those years where I just didn’t so I’m always curious. What made you do it and how did it feel when you did.

06:24.73
Tim Roberts
And what maybe do it was that realization and so the first thing I did was I wrote a letter to myself I let sat in work I went I’m just going downstairs to do something and and sat there wrote a letter and then I sent it to my wife and.

06:31.71
katrinamcollier
Ah, yeah, yeah.

06:44.53
Tim Roberts
My wife knew I wasn’t right? Um, she’d mentioned before you know she’d actually asked me in the months building up to this. She’s thinking you might have depression of course that’s that no I’m fine I’m just having a bad you know’m in a bad mood or works shit or you know what? whatever excuse I used and.

06:45.62
katrinamcollier
M.

06:57.53
katrinamcollier
Yeah, there’s too much. Um, there’s something around that word isn’t there. You’d go into denial. No I don’t want to own that word, you know? yeah.

07:03.40
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yes, yeah, that’s not me that um, um, ah you fight it and it I mean I actually emailed it to my wife God bless her while she was at work now that might sound like a quite selfish thing to do yet in that moment and and maybe in the person that I am if I’ve got an idea.

07:18.16
katrinamcollier
M.

07:22.55
Tim Roberts
Ah, get on and do it so what I didn’t want to do was kind of carry that around with me all day or messes my wife and Sarah I needa talks. It’s tonight mean plus we’ve got two kids so it’s also hard that you get home from where the the kids don’t understand that mom and dad need to talk about something you know they they want to show you a barby doll or talk to you about whatever it might be so so just ah for me it was that.

07:22.65
katrinamcollier
Yes.

07:29.82
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

07:36.55
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, um.

07:42.20
Tim Roberts
Right? send? um and my wife so understanding. She messaged me and you know so said and said why don’t We just both go home from work and I said no I want to see the day out and it went from there. We got home and my wife encouraged me shall I say to go and see a Gp um which it it worked not in the way the Gp just did because they wanted me to go on antidepressants I was.

07:54.51
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

08:01.81
Tim Roberts
I was adamant I wasn’t doing that now although antipressants weren’t for a lot of people I know they’re important I was determined not to do it. Ah yes, and I ah ah by fluke and I’ve I’ve had 2 operations on me back and as part of the.

08:05.82
katrinamcollier
Urged. Um I Also don’t work for a lot of people.

08:16.46
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, um.

08:18.11
Tim Roberts
Pain killlling process leading up those operations I was prescribed a pill that I didn’t know at the time wasn’t antidepressant. It basically gets you to sleep because it cuts the nerves off that the pain sends to your brain so it was great at the time but my God I’ve got anger over taking those pills.

08:32.50
katrinamcollier
Rice.

08:35.59
katrinamcollier
And.

08:35.59
Tim Roberts
Ah, remember going into work and feeling like and I’ve had some angerover was some alcohol trust me and this was worse than any of them and so it I was I was like I don’t want antidepressants because they’ll send me worse. So so I suppose to Gp they they listen to me they diagnosed with with severe depression.

08:41.58
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

08:52.96
Tim Roberts
And I totally it one pill they refer me to some therapist and counselor and I went I went through the motions with that at first and ultimately it ended up I had 2 great conversations and then because there’s very little funding in therapy and for for somebody like me where where.

09:07.64
katrinamcollier
Yeah, or the nhs. Yeah.

09:12.70
Tim Roberts
Yeah, because I don’t have Pcsd Just for example, it’s very very hard for them to help a man of a certain age who isn’t really considered to have this you know, diagnosable ah suffering or mental health. Whatever it might be you know? ah.

09:15.40
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

09:28.43
katrinamcollier
Yeah I guess it with P with ptsd. There’s a moment they can like and and you said you couldn’t find them what sorry you said that before we came on her I should say that that you you couldn’t find a moment to justify the that would have made it hard for them.

09:31.69
Tim Roberts
Ah, yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, and I never have for that moold I’ve not gone searching for it because when I did therapy I tried it with a charity.

09:47.82
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

09:50.30
Tim Roberts
I’ve also paid for a couple of different counselors over the years as well. What I found was that I didn’t find the benefit of looking for the reason and and that’s a lot about my personality. It’s I’m ambitious I’m driven so I’m future focused. So what I found when I was doing that I just got frustrated because I went looking for.

09:59.94
katrinamcollier
Right? Yeah, um.

10:09.29
Tim Roberts
How do I move forward from this and all I got was questions about explore it. Why do you think you felt like that what might have caused that and us but like I want to move forward. So so yeah I mean it all stem from speaking to my why and it is you know look did this message that sometimes goes out there about mental Health where.

10:11.56
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, um.

10:26.46
Tim Roberts
Right? This campaign’s encourages and justice to speak to somebody. It’s so important that people take notice of that because that that’s what saved me that was the first thing that made me go this is okay to talk about.

10:30.80
katrinamcollier
Yeah, so you did yeah and you did talk to someone you just chose a path forward which is fine. It’s funny every time you said this and before we came on as well.

10:41.46
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

10:48.99
katrinamcollier
There is a book called it didn’t start with you which I really think that you should read because I have a feeling it’s going to really resonate because I just you know with my my weird feelings I get that this isn’t because you said that you can’t pinpoint anything in your life that would lead you to this point. So I have a feeling you’ll find it’s in the genetics.

10:52.60
Tim Roberts
Okay.

11:06.90
Tim Roberts
It Yes, it it could be a so members of my close family have also suffered with depression and mental health issues challenges. Definitely an anxiety So it yeah.

11:08.51
katrinamcollier
It’s a really fascinating book Anyway, so just have have a ring actually.

11:16.54
katrinamcollier
Yeah, there is a lot of generational trauma coming down as well. So yeah, so.

11:24.91
Tim Roberts
Yeah, it could be and it um I mean you know whether it goes bats I was bullied as a kid you know I don’t I don’t know um you know it could be something like that for me, it was about I’ve got to move forward because I didn’t want to.

11:38.31
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

11:41.58
Tim Roberts
Didn’t want to kind of almost go. Okay, let’s stop everything and find out what this is and look that works for some people. It’s really really important that I’m talking about what works for me I felt that there was power in I can take control I can choose how to respond to this. You know that one of the things I say to people to talk about for mental Health is.

11:46.21
katrinamcollier
Yeah, absolutely yeah.

11:56.48
katrinamcollier
Me.

12:00.84
Tim Roberts
My emotional intelligence saved my life and what I did through speaking to my wife first um and then by speaking to my best friend and all the best mate did was listen to me that’s that’s that’s all he did you know I speak to about it now. He’s like I didn’t do anything I’m like you listen to me mate. That’s all I needed and that.

12:02.54
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

12:18.18
katrinamcollier
Did he listen without judgment as well.

12:20.69
Tim Roberts
Gave me? Yes, yeah, that’s really important So that’s what he did was he listened without judgment and you know from then on and and still to this day you know He’re checking with me and that gave me a confidence to then go and speak to some other close friends and you know they listened without judgment. They said you know it’s It’s okay and that’s.

12:26.63
katrinamcollier
M.

12:33.21
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

12:39.22
Tim Roberts
That gave me the courage to then go and speak at events about it and and share my story and the the big thing for me was that piece around I can choose how to respond to my thoughts and feelings. So even in the darkest days I could I could choose to go. Okay.

12:43.80
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah.

12:54.52
katrinamcollier
Ah.

12:57.18
Tim Roberts
This is what would help me right now. This is what would help me right now and that allowed me to take control and say actually I don’t need to sit and take this I can make my world be what I want my world to be. There was great power that came from it and you know this is what I mean.

13:01.63
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

13:13.43
katrinamcollier
Yeah, it’s interesting. Yeah sorry I interrupted you of course I’m really good at that. No no because it’s funny because ah we we we went different paths but both of the paths involved.

13:16.65
Tim Roberts
What with gone sir now go you go you go is Sarah.

13:28.62
Tim Roberts
Bunching.

13:30.90
katrinamcollier
Having to recognize what you were saying to yourself Basically like you know what’s going on in the head and I’ve had time so I’ve had to consciously go. Why are you thinking that stop it like and I I would do something like think about my dog I would have a specific thing that would take me into the present and into something really lovely.

13:32.51
Tim Roberts
Yes, yeah.

13:39.77
Tim Roberts
Yet.

13:46.83
Tim Roberts
Yeah.

13:48.75
katrinamcollier
Instead of whatever it was and it’s you’re doing a similar thing. You’ve just worked out almost how to do it on your own. It sounds like.

13:53.71
Tim Roberts
Yes, yes, a lot of that a lot of it came from the books that I read the work that I do so as a leadership coach and specialized in most intelligence. Ah you know I had an understanding of it I’m an nlp practitioner so I had an understanding of it and yes through.

14:03.60
katrinamcollier
Ah, yeah, so.

14:12.44
Tim Roberts
Other people’s help so coachings help me a great deal I have an unbelievable coach who gives me the chance to come up with little strategies and gives me the space to think about it and the space to challenge myself to talk things through and.

14:14.67
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

14:27.70
Tim Roberts
You know to be okay that I’ll have bad days I think that’s the big thing now and us 5 years on from that that moment. Those bad days are less and less the last five years haven’t been all blue skies in sunshine I’ve I’ve had some really out challenging times yet I’m now able to respond better.

14:28.45
katrinamcollier
Um.

14:35.10
katrinamcollier
Um.

14:44.41
katrinamcollier
Um.

14:46.86
Tim Roberts
I’m now able to recognize it and you know not allow it to to get? oh you know the things you said there actually that there’s a lot of things that it can be simple things to me like right I know I’m in a bit of a mess at the moment. So for an hour just going listen into music and read but read a book go for a walk sometimes it might be.

14:55.50
katrinamcollier
E.

15:01.45
katrinamcollier
So.

15:06.54
Tim Roberts
Just have a glass of wine your wife and chill out I’m I’m not suggesting I don’t I don’t self-medicate. That’s sort. Ah alcohol isn’t the answer but sometimes it is you know what? I just need to sit here have a glass of wine and just tell you a bit of shit you know and just relax and kind of throw it all out.

15:13.90
katrinamcollier
Um.

15:19.72
katrinamcollier
Yeah, but actually it’s the talking isn’t it. You’re still talking and she’s still listening and it’s yeah, a connection.

15:24.74
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yes, yeah, and it’s that bit of almost going So the wine is the bit of this doesn’t need to be a serious conversation. You know I just need to say that I’m having a bit of struggle at the moment and so that you know it could be things like that it could be.

15:38.38
katrinamcollier
Has it? How has it helped your relationship have has it have you grown closer because you are now much more open and honest rather than trying to keep that mask up.

15:41.96
Tim Roberts
Go go out and be may it could be.

15:48.35
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yeah, Definitely Yeah I think it the big thing that’s helped It is my awareness. So ah, a my wife can kind of say all right? You have a bad day or to just want to go and chill out and and then don’t I don’t take a fence at that. Because I know what she’s trying to do is help me. You know I know that she might just make subtle hints Sometimes so yeah, definitely and it allows us when we might have a difficult thing to talk about. Um you know I don’t know our parents aren’t getting any younger kids are getting older, whatever it might be.

16:09.59
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

16:15.91
katrinamcollier
Um.

16:22.43
katrinamcollier
Ah, a.

16:27.49
Tim Roberts
We’re much able to just talk about it quickly and move on I think that’s part of the thing that it’s helps in our relationship. It doesn’t fester. You know sometimes I have to be the one that says oh sorry I’ve been a dickheady. Let’s just stop. Let’s just chill out you know and and I think that’s the big thing. It’s helps with is.

16:28.20
katrinamcollier
Ah.

16:31.42
katrinamcollier
Yeah, and.

16:41.76
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

16:45.64
Tim Roberts
The awareness whereas in the past I think before I heard the words from a Gp you’ve got severe depression I was probably seeking an excuse or blaming other things like like we do you know, blaming work and you know it’s other people’s fault and this isn’t fair and you know trying to look for a way out. The reality is I was just.

16:54.48
katrinamcollier
Who.

17:05.63
Tim Roberts
In thatrendous cycle of depression and fighting it whereas when I got it out in the open. It’s okay, that’s what it is. It’s okay that you know and and now a big thing for me is I can see the warning signs. So I know that.

17:08.90
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah.

17:18.30
katrinamcollier
So.

17:21.20
Tim Roberts
Can see in my past I was building up to it so that might have been where I got myself run down I tried to do too much both socializing and in work or do we trying to do too much for the kids trying to do too much for other people thinking I could do everything and then eventually it it just it.

17:25.95
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, um.

17:33.67
katrinamcollier
Martin.

17:38.14
Tim Roberts
Cuts you down doesn’t it it. It just stops you when you track So I can see that now and I’ll say no to things better now.

17:38.55
katrinamcollier
Yeah, so what are some of those signs is it just exhaustion or is it when you’re not swimming in the morning or like what are the what are the signs. What do you sense that it’s coming.

17:49.43
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yeah, so it can be exhaustion. It can be um, the first signs you might be getting a bit of an illness so a cough or a sore throat. That’s a bit of a warning sound for me because in the past i’s kind of thought oh’ll be all right? You know then.

18:01.35
katrinamcollier
Um, ah yeah.

18:05.56
Tim Roberts
Go away for work for a week driving up and out the country and then come over spend 2 nights out with my friends on my wife and then suddenly on the Sunday and Monday you’re half dead. So it’s little things like that. It’s the motivation if I’m not feeling that motivated then okay check in y.

18:11.87
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, um.

18:23.62
katrinamcollier
I am.

18:24.17
Tim Roberts
And and the the checkin for me. There is what’s the reality of this situation I’m not motivated because i’mnackered from the last two weeks or whatever it might be or I’m overwhelmed or is the reality I’m not that motivated because the work I’m doing this week isn’t one ah hundred percent of

18:36.60
katrinamcollier
Ah.

18:44.27
Tim Roberts
Fulfillment for me, you know I might be at home for a couple of days without any calls or I might I might be doing a bit of work that just doesn’t really excite me kind of things you know that so it’s checking in on that. Yeah yeah, it is that it.

18:46.13
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yes, admin yeah as the quarterly vat. Yeah, ah.

19:01.96
Tim Roberts
Sometimes I know as well for me, there’s a sign of if I’ve got something big on the horizon like building up to my first book being published last year. Oh my god um, my publisher didn’t kill me I don’t know my wife didn’t kill me when I and it was the same absolutely when I was turning 40 ah coincidentally in 2018 although if anybody asked I’m 39

19:03.40
katrinamcollier
I Know you’re married. Yeah yeah.

19:18.15
katrinamcollier
Um.

19:21.94
Tim Roberts
That because that was on the horizon. But yeah when when I’ve got something big on the horizon. That’s really important to me I know that that starts the the anticipation of it starts to manifest itself and.

19:22.73
katrinamcollier
Ah, well I’m still older than you even with that mouth. So ah.

19:31.49
katrinamcollier
Yeah. And.

19:39.80
Tim Roberts
You know if something then happens like a client changes a day or my wife starts asking me about things that I’m thinking that’s not important right now it triggers the stress. So there’s there’s that I’m trying to build up to that is is that bit of okay I know I’ve got this really? So um, it’s it’s happening So in the moment I’ve got a really really big.

19:46.90
katrinamcollier
Um.

19:58.10
Tim Roberts
Program starting in November with a new client. A big coaching program and it’s just in the back of my mind so I have to just remind myself. It’s okay, you’ve got that daybook team to sort everything out, you’ve got a call with a client November will happen. Enjoy what’s coming between then and now you know take the time now.

20:05.56
katrinamcollier
Ah, yeah.

20:13.46
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah I So yeah, exactly and also um, a few things that I do around that as well as like um I’ll often panic like oh my God I haven’t got enough time. It’s like well hang on.

20:17.60
Tim Roberts
To relax conserve energy before your health ever.

20:31.80
katrinamcollier
You had enough time that time and remember when you put that presentation together in an I took an hour and you thought I’d take all that like and I just I Michelle Zeli used to call it evidence to the contrary and it’s like telling the in a voice. Well well here’s some evidence to the contrary and it’s like calm down.

20:32.15
Tim Roberts
Yes.

20:41.55
Tim Roberts
Yay. Yeah, yeah.

20:47.90
katrinamcollier
Kind of and it still ah brings you back to the moment again and like you’re just panicking and you always have enough time and you always do a great job and everyone’s you know and it’s everyone’s been happy with your work and it’s just like reminding. It’s almost having a list so that when you know you’re going to go through that as it.

20:49.33
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it’s yeah yeah, yeah.

21:03.83
katrinamcollier
Closer and panic and go Yeah I’ve always have enough time and actually I am ready and it’s yeah I’m sure your coach gives you these? yeah.

21:05.98
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yeah, that I like that it the evidence piece I think it’s a great way looking at it I Always think about it So I have a concept called ah your bullshit factory and that’s come from my experiences with mental health and it comes from working with leaders and everything else that see happening. So.

21:15.47
katrinamcollier
Um.

21:20.98
katrinamcollier
Yeah, um.

21:25.78
Tim Roberts
For me, it’s not moving from bullshit to truth so just using that as an example lay. You’re right that for me that thing on the horizon in November the evidence is I’ve done that before the client wants me to do it I know I’ve got time and actually what I really know is those two days I be 2 of the best days of this year because I’m really excited to work with this client I’ve I’ve been building up so it’ been.

21:29.58
katrinamcollier
Um, yes, yeah, yeah, yeah.

21:43.67
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, wow.

21:45.37
Tim Roberts
Talking about it for probably 2 years we get on brilliantly. They want me because I the way I do things. So yeah I think that’s a nice thing to look at is moving if that bullshit true friend I think something that is is a bit similar to that. Yes, it yeah well take your old advice isn’t it. You know a great.

21:55.60
katrinamcollier
Um, um, using your own tools bad Tim ah yeah, is it? Um, yeah.

22:04.51
Tim Roberts
Great friend of mine Danny Seal’s said that to me years ago. Tim take your own I’m stressing out about this conference I was speaking at and you know he said to me Tim take your own advice and that’s that’s a big big thing for me is actually almost stopping going right? If my mate came to me or if a client came to me and said this is what I’m thinking.

22:13.28
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

22:22.30
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, exactly yeah, however, that it is hard and this is why you have a coach and I have a coach.

22:24.50
Tim Roberts
What advice would it give them all what coaching questions would I ask them and flip it back around to to me and I think it’s a big thing I’ve learned Itis yes.

22:38.64
katrinamcollier
Because you want them to listen and repeat back to you. Do you know you’re saying this through that entire and you’re like really so yes, and no, it’s no yeah.

22:42.72
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that importance of somebody to hold the mirror up is massive again. That’s that’s what I found more beneficial to me rather than the ah. Looking for a reason or the catalyst you know in the past actually holding the mirror up to say Tim this is what you’ve said you won this is what you want to achieve and this is how you’re coming across. That’s absolutely invaluable to me now that that is a coaching process for me. Definitely I have.

23:00.71
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

23:07.96
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah.

23:17.20
Tim Roberts
Friends and mentors who would also you know hold me accountable to that and you know for for me just there’s 2 big things I think I add as well that just massive help me 2 is the work that I do I could see in that year when I when I took that step to get that help.

23:32.00
katrinamcollier
Ah.

23:35.82
Tim Roberts
What I could see in that moment was I’d got to that point where I loved what I do I’m really passionate about it I Really believe in it had worked me, ask off to get to the point where internally I could say yeah I I’m all right at this I’m pretty good.

23:40.90
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

23:49.63
katrinamcollier
La.

23:51.43
Tim Roberts
I’ve I’ve got results to demonstrate of what I do helps people and I’ve got results to prove what i’ I’ve done it with myself as a leader for example, So what I realized is I needed freedom. Ah I couldn’t have people stopping me or organizational cultures getting in the way because I’m someone who gives a shit I really care.

23:54.36
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

24:09.34
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

24:11.22
Tim Roberts
About people and helping them and I care about myself and wanting to be happy. Basically I don’t think that’s selfish why why wouldn’t I Once be happy So I throw myself into my work. Ah no, no I know so I.

24:16.85
katrinamcollier
Ah.

24:20.10
katrinamcollier
But it’s not a dress rehearsal is it. You know, let’s enjoy it.

24:27.28
Tim Roberts
Yeah, so I’ve put everything into the work that I do speaks particularly the way I do it in terms of the authenticity piece and breaking the mold to sorry to use the Tat Lumber but and then the second bit for me that I learn is I’m really values driven.

24:32.52
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, no, that’s okay.

24:44.49
Tim Roberts
It’s really really important to me a lot of that comes from my understanding of and Nlp because the reality is we’re all actually values driven. It just depends on your level of awareness and understanding of it that heightens. How much value you put on it part of the pun.

24:45.63
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

24:52.68
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, and and are they your values or put on values so I did um much as he he’s quite polarizing. Um Dr John d martinis values so

25:01.99
Tim Roberts
Ah, yes.

25:10.20
katrinamcollier
I know mine from that which I oh my goodness for some reason benja has taken to um, being a very irritating during this podcasts. He’s currently yeah I don if you’ve heard him. It’s like come try to quiet him down he I think he gets jealous at about 5 minute mark of each podcast recording. It’s so bad.

25:13.73
Tim Roberts
I know I love that you jogs in the background I Love it.

25:22.18
Tim Roberts
He wants to get in on it.

25:29.36
katrinamcollier
I lock him out you’re here and crying through the door. So I can’t win. Um, but anyway yeah, um so Demartini’s values factor is absolutely awesome as well for that getting your real values as opposed to the put on ones see you work those out like angel doesn’t it.

25:34.18
Tim Roberts
Yes. Yeah, yeah, and that was massive effort and I think I always I always knew I was very values driven and and and this isn’t from a point of view of let’s take them over high ground like said and and like the work you’re talking about there. It was that understanding of when I.

25:50.60
katrinamcollier
Um.

25:52.85
katrinamcollier
No.

25:58.51
Tim Roberts
Really happy and confident. It’s because I’m surrounded by people who respect my values and I’m able to live up to my values without it being challenged or dismissed conversely when I’m really negative and down I’m surrounded by people who.

26:00.76
katrinamcollier
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

26:14.92
Tim Roberts
Don’t respect those values and don’t live up to their own values. So the organization I was in in 2018 is just a perfect demonstration of lack of integrity and integrity is off the scale important to me if you say you’re going to do something do it. It’s it’s really really important to me so when I’m surrounded by people who.

26:19.15
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

26:28.16
katrinamcollier
Um, important for you? yeah.

26:34.38
Tim Roberts
Don’t do that. You take the piss. Basically I can’t handle that it makes it very hard. So I’ve learned that it’s really important to me. But then what I’ve learned a big big help to me is having the confidence and and this is ah this was a breakthrough for me.

26:40.95
katrinamcollier
Um, hello I’m with you.

26:50.48
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

26:52.10
Tim Roberts
Because I I’ve now switched this So I’d come away from experiences that were negative for me and working with people or just engaging with people that conflicted with my values and I kind of come away and blame myself and beat myself up and think about I should have done this I should have done that and what I’ve learned is to be able to flip that now.

27:00.20
katrinamcollier
Ah.

27:04.16
katrinamcollier
I I.

27:10.99
Tim Roberts
And recognize actually their attitudes and behaviors reflects on them all I can do is choose to live up to what I stand for and choose in response my attitudes and behaviors to be the ones that I can walk away from that situation and go that’s okay Dan might have behaved this way.

27:14.20
katrinamcollier
Yes.

27:25.30
katrinamcollier
Um.

27:31.80
Tim Roberts
I’m happy that my attitude and behaviors were right for me and live up to what I stand for and if that means I walk away and I don’t know who Dan is by the way and mine and Dan’s relationship is broken I’m sure he is I’m all right with that.

27:32.60
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, I’m sure he’s lovely. Yeah, yeah, and.

27:45.25
Tim Roberts
You know, whereas years ago I was probably seeking Dan’s approval or seeking validation whereas the massive twist at a shift for me through coaching is actually I can’t impose my values on other people. All I can do is choose to respond.

27:49.27
katrinamcollier
Yes, yeah.

27:59.29
katrinamcollier
No, you cannot yeah um.

28:01.42
Tim Roberts
Based on my own values and then I can go to bed at night I can wake up tomorrow and go even if I lose that work with that client am I happy my attitudes and behaviors align to what I stand for move on and the power of that for me is massive. Yeah.

28:09.50
katrinamcollier
Yeah, that’s okay, yeah, the first time is huge. The the first time I fired a client. Oh so liberating when you realize like this isn’t what I want to be doing so I’m not lighting up.

28:20.59
Tim Roberts
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

28:27.48
katrinamcollier
And they’re disrespecting me. They’re not heading. You know my values and that sort of thing. Um, but I found um it was interesting reading his book but you know so many I mean these won’t shock you. It’s about speaking it’s about being heard. It’s about being building a community. It’s absolutely about fun and it’s about freedom with ah a dollop of authenticity Of course.

28:39.46
Tim Roberts
Yet yet.

28:46.74
katrinamcollier
And it’s like if I do those 5 things I am so happy. But I think it’s what I’ve seen you do is what I’ve done over the twelve years I took a leap of faith and started my business and then started healing in retrospect I would have healed and then started my business just saying but you know, um, but might have been a bit easier but you know.

28:48.60
Tim Roberts
Yes.

29:04.34
katrinamcollier
Throw yourself in the deep end but it sounds like you’ve gone from that actually being unsure and full of self-doubt and taking responsibility for stuff that wasn’t yours you’ve moved into I like what I’m doing I’m liking myself doing this and you’re starting to like yourself.

29:16.70
Tim Roberts
Yes.

29:21.10
katrinamcollier
And therefore attract clients that really respect that and then you’re doing this exciting work. So it’s you’ve chat you’ve had quite a shift there.

29:23.93
Tim Roberts
Yes, it massively? Yeah and thank you I said that probably never stops to think about that. Actually yeah I I know that today the work I’m doing that brings me so much. Joy. You know it. It truly is I’m not I’m not a workaholic or anything like that I just to me that going in a room and I I as a speaker on stage of running team coaching sessions or working 1 to 1 as an exec coach I just love it I absolutely buzz off it and I found that that’s.

29:41.46
katrinamcollier
Ah.

29:54.80
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

29:57.60
Tim Roberts
Such a big part of shifting away from that depression now I I a way for me overcoming. My depression is I accept I will have it for the rest of my life and that’s because I don’t want it to surprise me at some point and also to keep me motivated that. Ah.

30:01.80
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah.

30:09.52
katrinamcollier
Um.

30:15.28
Tim Roberts
This is an ongoing battle I’ll have it for the rest of my lives and that’s okay I’m all right with that because what that does is motivate me to keep developing. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

30:15.77
katrinamcollier
Yeah, or maybe maybe it’s maybe it’s a challenge less of a battle because that sounds less exhausting but it’s also it’s a signal to you that you’re not doing the things that light you up because actually it happened even though you were.

30:30.92
Tim Roberts
Yes.

30:34.95
katrinamcollier
Doing the work in a place where you weren’t respected and there wasn’t integrity. You know your high values. So actually maybe it’s just a whoo I’m starting to feel this well where what piece isn’t sitting right in what I’m doing what’s not in my value set. What’s going on here. It sounds like you’ve got a nice little flag to go.

30:36.42
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yes.

30:44.55
Tim Roberts
Yes, yeah, yeah, you’re right? It’s that awareness. Yeah, yeah, it’s like the red the red flare going open.

30:53.79
katrinamcollier
Ah, hello I’m just setting you know I’m here. What’s not right? Yeah, um, little way to this is back to signs again.

31:01.59
Tim Roberts
There’s also a bit of me with that in terms of me saying? Yeah yeah is it’s like it to me on the back of the edge kind of thing but ah, a big reason. The other reason why I’ve said to myself. It’s okay that a lot depression for the rest of my life is because when when I first beats it I’ll do that in inverted covers.

31:11.62
katrinamcollier
Ah.

31:19.17
katrinamcollier
Yeah.

31:21.40
Tim Roberts
Ah, then got complacent and I and ah told myself that’s it all right now you know mit I probably had I don’t know three or six months without any really really bad episodes and and then when it came back. Oh wow was that hard. You know that was like everything.

31:31.60
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, um.

31:40.27
Tim Roberts
Times 10 that I’d experienced before for a shorter period So that and a part of that was me going. Yeah, why have I been such an idiot of course I haven’t beaten it. It’s always going to come back. What I have to do is be consistent in the habits that help me the exer exercisesing the meditating doing the work I Love doing living up’s what I stand for. You know, spending the time with people who I love and bring me joy doing the things that I love doing and bring me joy.

32:01.41
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, okay I have to ask timber but I can’t imagine you meditating did it take a while for you to get to do that or is your swimming meditation.

32:14.50
Tim Roberts
It now it’s it’s mindfulness. No at your what and a touch to it. Oh God Yeah I talk to it So well. Yes.

32:17.99
katrinamcollier
So you can you so how was it just just quickly because like we’ve run over I normally do 30 minutes and we’ve already run over but how was it did you were you able to find stillness like was that easy for you to do that. Ah I’m impressed.

32:33.56
Tim Roberts
Yeah I love I love mindfulness. Yeah, and so ah ah I got introduced it through me n lp through the wonderful Jimmy petruy and typical of me like said before I got an idea ran with it went and got qualified in it read every bloody book on it. You know, signed up to headspace.

32:35.11
katrinamcollier
Because I you knew you highgie to me? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

32:51.94
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, oh good.

32:53.20
Tim Roberts
And I love it and I ah now I can do it I always jog about I can do it on a trade I sometimes do it. You know a stop in a car parkt when I’m about to go to work I’ll do it in there I do it in the toilets for 2 minutes yeah I mean my my practice is 10 minutes a day and then I do it when I need it so I did probably.

33:04.13
katrinamcollier
That’s five ten minutes yeah yeah Yeah,

33:12.39
Tim Roberts
1 minute before I joined this podcast because it’s just that stillness. Maybe maybe like you say because I have high energy maybe that allows me that that stopping that stillness allows me to put the high energy into the right place or maybe before I was doing mindfulness and you know I learned.

33:18.79
katrinamcollier
Still breathing. Um, yeah.

33:32.13
Tim Roberts
When I was in those really bad depressive moments the the mindfulness. Okay, some days it it. It didn’t work because but that’s just because it was so intense and nothing was gonna work other than getting through the day. So yeah I Absolute Love Mindfulness I Recommend it to everybody to my friends. Yeah I’m a huge.

33:36.52
katrinamcollier
Um.

33:43.31
katrinamcollier
Um, yeah, yeah.

33:49.62
katrinamcollier
Ah, so cool. Yeah, no, it’s just I mean it took me. Yeah, it took me ages to be able to sit still and Meditatpe It looks really true and now of course it’s like a given you know it’s something that I do quite a lot So but I also I mean I Just do it walking banjo as well like it’s that.

33:51.57
Tim Roberts
Paid up member of it.

33:56.70
Tim Roberts
Yeah.

34:04.63
Tim Roberts
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, yes, yeah.

34:06.84
katrinamcollier
Light let the mind wander and have no judgment of it and I get all my best ideas and that kind of thing now if people wish to get in touch with Tim Roberts and obviously mention that they heard you hear on the podcast so that you get excited? Um, but where’s the best place. What’s the is it the old linked deam but you have a website.

34:14.17
Tim Roberts
Yet.

34:22.81
Tim Roberts
Yeah, the best place would be Linkedin so I’m I’m Tim Roberts so my company. My coaching company is called enthusescoing so you could go to my website enthusecoaching.com but you had best place. Follow me connect with me on Linkedin.

34:24.61
katrinamcollier
What’s easiest. Ah.

34:33.87
katrinamcollier
Yeah, our link of course. But.

34:38.60
Tim Roberts
And yeah, the book is available in all good bookstores at Amazon Waterstones which is called break the mold break the old volume one? Yeah, ah yes.

34:40.82
katrinamcollier
And it’s called again just in case they missed it I know because you said it there you just wished it in the middle air. So break them old volume one full that means there’s a volume 2

34:57.00
Tim Roberts
Yeah, funly enough actually just by pure ah twist of timing this weekend I’m taking myself off to a hotel room in Birmingham for four days to start the writing process in earnest so I’ve got all the ideas I’ve got the structure because I found when I wrote the first book.

35:07.85
katrinamcollier
I ah.

35:15.76
Tim Roberts
And again, maybe this is around the the everything we’ve been talking about really I found I had to just disappear for a few days because I couldn’t do an hour here and hour there and ah that ah maybe maybe the writing is all well Also a bit of meditation for me because when I’m in that zone of writing and I’ve got music on oh my God I’m so happy.

35:18.63
katrinamcollier
Um, yep, yeah.

35:31.36
katrinamcollier
Oh it’s lovely. Yeah, oh I can’t I have to be in silence. Oh and amazing. It’s coming ah exciting I I I cannot write with music on I’m impressed you can I have to have silence.

35:35.15
Tim Roberts
so so yeah by pure twist of time in ah, starting later this week yeah so yeah, yes, definitely.

35:47.50
Tim Roberts
Really? oh no I mean I’m obsessed with music it. It’s obviously my book I use a lot of lyrics. So yeah, it’s yeah, music is the ah the life for me. It’s just everything there.

35:48.69
katrinamcollier
No dog crying either. It helps you? Yeah amazing. You will find the second one easier. The first book is the hardest I’ve found writing the memoir after having written one. It’s like I know I can do it now. So it’s like.

36:04.87
Tim Roberts
Yeah.

36:07.53
katrinamcollier
Words fly more easily or I don’t if it’s a bit’s not working I just go on and start something else and then I come back to the bit that wasn’t working and figure it all out like a puzzle isn’t it. So yeah, exciting. Oh I will look forward to that I sense I might be getting a call on Sunday yeah liar.

36:11.88
Tim Roberts
Yeah, yes, yeah well I hope you’re right I Hope you right? I believe yeah so yeah.

36:25.40
Tim Roberts
Yeah, sun demo they go I put up all night you said this was easy. Ah.

36:26.50
katrinamcollier
And we some fine yeah and it’ll be like 6 a m or something horrible. But anyway, thank you Mr. Roberts thank you so so much for joining me here. Thanks.

36:35.69
Tim Roberts
Ah, thank you. It’s always a pleasure Katrina thank you.